The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Big flywheel and starter

I have two small problems with the new 64 C60. The original power came from a small block 327 and a Clark 267V transmission. First the starter is missing, it is bell housing mounted with 3 bolts like what most of us are use to however this bell housing, houses a huge 16.5” 197 tooth flywheel. Dose anyone know if this starter is still available and possibly know a part number?
The second problem is the flywheel it self. Dose anyone know if they are available for externally balanced big block 454? I would really like to use this transmission with the huge 13” clutch that it uses with the 496 I had built for my 56 and put the 350 from the 64 GMC in the 56.

I would think that the flywheel from a later chevy truck with a 454 truck motor should work. After they quit the 427 in about 79 or 80 they went to the 454 in 2 tons. A flywheel from a 3/4 ton with small block 400 might also be big enough to fit a 13" clutch. I don't know when they went to the double disc clutch but the flywheel should be the same. They should still make the starter or at least have remanned ones.

This flywheel will not even fit in a standard bell housing it is huge. I guess even if I could find the same flywheel for a 366 or 427 I could have it balanced with mallory mettle even a 454 flywheel will have to have some balance work to work with this 496 that I have.

Like I said this flywheel is 16.5 inches around has 197 teeth it also has a pilot bearing support with a 3" OD that holds a bearing with 1" ID the input shaft on the transmission it 1.5 inch 10 spline.

Hy HevyHauler, I believe the o.e.m. p/n for the starter is 1108345, I'll try to cross that to something else. As to the flywheel, I believe 1979 was the first year 454 engines were available in heavy trucks, the 60 and 70 series I think, unfortunately my newest parts book is up to 1971, [guess I'll have to start collecting more parts books and maintenance manuals], I hope that helps some

Thanks 3B I will have to give Napa a call with that number and if the 79 C60s and 70s use the same starter that sould be a pretty good clue for the flywheel.

I have those flywheel ring gears NOS.

The one I have is one piece flywheel and gear I just need one for big block and this one is small block.

This is 197 teeth and outside diameter is about 16.5"

Big Block????? and if so internal or external balance?

Check out this article about using the heavy truck bellhousing and flywheel. Starter part number is listed, among other good information.

http://www.jpmagazine.com/techarticles/drivetrain/154_0509_spicer_3053a_transmission/index.html

Hy jgetti, thank you very much for posting that link, a very informative article, thanks again!

I think I may have the flywheel, bell-housing and starter you need. It uses a 13 inch clutch, the bell-housing is attached via an adapter plate. It came from what I believe was a 62 -65 dump truck. The transmission was a Spicer 3152 and the engine a 348. Let me know if you have any interest.

Hy Donsz, the flywheel must be for a 454, as far as I know there are only two Chevy V8 engines which are externally balanced, the 454, and the 400 small block [not to be confused with the 402 big block]. I'm not sure if the flywheels are even interchangeable between the 400, and 454, but I do know that the 454 cannot use a flywheel that is not an externally balanced one, hope that helps.

3B: The only thing I know it came off a 348 which is considered a big block. Beyond that you are light years ahead of me in terms of subject-matter knowledge. Biggest flywheel I have ever seen though.

3B, it might be a really good idea to acquire that assembly, as it will give you a spare flywheel to experiment on. I have a former student who runs an auto machine shop, and he does some pretty impressive balancing on race engines. Chances are he could modify one of those big flywheels to work with the 454, as long as he has a starting point. It might be necessary to provide him with a 454 crankshaft and standard shift flywheel as a reference, and have him modify the big one to achieve the same balance after running the original assembly in the balancer. He might even have to modify the bolt circle and/or mounting flange area of the flywheel, but that's not an impossible job. I doubt if you're going to find off-the-shelf parts to make the swap.
Jerry

jgetti: thanks! That is just what I have. I remember seeing that article now when I was researching Spicer transmissions forgot all about it .

3B: I don't think the 348 and 409 flywheels have the same mounting but I can have the guy that built my 496 match balance any flywheel that will bolt up it is just easier to start with a 454 flywheel. He will have to add weight to an internally balanced motors flywheel

BTW I have found twin disk clutches in 13" that work with this set up !!

Thanks again jgetti that was just what the doctor ordered

Wow as it turns out I was wrong flywheels are the same from small block to big block Chevy. Yet one more reason I love Chevys!!! The best thing is that I have found that the internal balance flywheels can be used with the external balanced 400 sb and 454 bb by the use of this balance plate http://www.jegs.com/i/Fidanza/383/624541/10002/-1 cheap to looks as if I am in business once again!!!!
BTW the part number I got from the article that jgtti posted for the starter also checks out!!!

Hy HevyHauler, I don't mean to throw a wet blanket on things, but when I opened your link to the bolt on flywheel weight, I noticed they were talking about aluminum flywheels. I would just like you to confirm that that is enough weight to balance a large iron flywheel, also the two different design flywheels are quite a bit different in diameter, and I wonder if the weight placement for the smaller and obviously lighter flywheel will be correct to balance the larger and heavier flywheel. I just don't want anything to go wrong with this installation, so please verify this weight will do the job.

3B;

I think the external balance weight works with any neutral balanced flywheel or flex plate. The weight just makes up the differences between the two balance techniques. What I don't recall is whether the dampner/harmonic balancer needs to be neutral or externally balanced to work with the bolt on weight plate. I'm sure an experienced machine shop should have the answer.

SimS

Hy SimS, the balancer for the 454, and 400 small block are special items and have a weighted area to assist the weighted flywheel in externally balancing these engines. When the 454 first came out I worked in a speed shop, our new flywheel catalogues came out the next year, and they listed the same p/n for all the big block Chev engines. My boss sold a flywheel/clutch package to a rich kid, in about two weeks the kid and his dad were pounding on the counter telling us the parts we sold were crap cuz since they put them in the car vibrated all the time. It took awhile and a lot of shop time and money to figure out what was wrong, but my boss called the high perf parts guru at the local Chevy dealer, and he nailed the problem right away. Seems we weren't the only speed shop in town that this had happened to, and not the only city either, there were lawsuits flying around for years after that. And new pages for our flywheel catalogues with triple size print for the correct 454 flywheels were issued very shortly after this fiasco!

3B Yes these weights add what is needed for the difference to any neutrally balanced flywheel they make one for the 400 small block and one for the 454 big block. When I get the new weight I will need to take it and the flywheel along with the flywheel that the machinist balanced when the motor was built so he can match it. He will actually need to lighten the weight as the 496 stroker rotating assembly from Eagle that was used is a little closer to being internally balanced than a stock 454 The good thing about using the balance plat is if I ever wish to use an internal balanced motor I will be able to just install the flywheel without the plate.