The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The Electrical Bay jump-start problem...

I have just finished installing a TBI fuel injection on the 250ci inline6 in my '57 Chevy Suburban (I have also swapped the TH350 trans for TH700R4, but I do not think this has anything to do with this issue).
I did try to start the Suburban a few times in the last week, with no luck: my install needed some trouble-shooting! As a result, the battery of the Suburban (which up until a month ago was in a daily driver and very strong) is now dead, totally dead, like in no radio, no click from the solenoid, no headlights, really dead!
So I want to jump-start it with my '93 Buick Roadmaster, easy...
Well, no!
When the 2 cars are connected, the Suburban starter motor still barely spins and then nothing, again... like it is not "receiving" the electricity from the Buick;
Then, after a few minutes (less than 10), the handles on the jumper cables get hot, very hot, so hot that the plastic handles on the clamps start to melt...
And then, the Buick dies, dead battery!!!
The jumper cables are good quality, heavy enough, I have used those for many years; the connectors on the Suburban are very clean, both on battery and starter motor; the Buick is very clean overall.
What is happening?
And how do I fix it?

Ditto on the shorted battery. If the internal resistance of the dead battery is low enough, it will take the full output of the boost vehicle's alternator, plus drain the battery, without building up a charge in the dead one. It's like trying to fill up a bucket with a big hole in the bottom! If you can get the cell caps off, look for one cell that gassing violently or boiling the acid- - - -that one's shorted!
Jerry

Thanks guys, I like it when 2 people have the same opinion! I guess I will take the battery to the store to be tested...
At least, if that is indeed the issue, it is not too hard to fix!

Sounds like a dead short, in the system. ditto on all of the above. Check your batt. cables. Shorts some times show up in fires. Be on your toes, have help handy. Becarefull Floyd.

What caused this problem? Is it purely a battery failure or was it caused by something else? I would not to get a new battery to have my truck kill it instantly!

As you install the new battery, before bolting the cables on solidly, just lightly touch the ground cable to the battery post after installing the insulated cable. If there's a big flash of current with all the circuits turned off, leave it disconnected and start looking for a short somewhere. It could be a cable rubbing on the frame, a shorted starter switch, or some other source of high current draw.
Jerry

Before putting in new battery make up a jumper with a light bulb in it. Hook up ground on battery. Hook jumper to lead from starter solenoid (make sure taped and isolated from body) Hook other end of jumper to battery.
IF lite does not light you are OK - hook up battery.
IF lite lites you got something either turned on or you have a grounded connection. Pull all fuses and try again - if lite does not light now put in fuses one at a time to find what circuit trouble is in and go from there.

Dan Bentler

Yes, Dan - much better than looking for a spark. I once found (40 years ago) a short that was very very slowly draining a battery by using your technique - a short in a 6v electric clock in a VW beetle. I followed HRL's "traceback" technique (above) but used a light (and a continuity tester) as you describe.

Finding a dead short by arcing the battery is a bad idea, my neighbor accidentally shorted a lawn tractor battery......he's still finding acid stains and pieces of plastic all over his shop

Good advice! Batteries give off hydrogen gas as they charge, and the atmosphere around the vents can get explosive. That's also a good reason to connect the ground side of a set of jumper cables to the engine block on both vehicles instead at the top of the battery. Connect hot to hot at the battery, then ground to ground as the final connections, as far away from the battery as possible. If you're working with a positive ground system, remember that hot on the boost vehicle will be ground on the + ground one. I've seen some cross-polarity hookups that got really exciting, and fried alternator rectifier diodes!
Jerry

So, here is the latest of my problem... still not solved...
I have had the starter checked, it is good.
I have removed the battery from the Suburban and connected a good battery (from my daily driver) directly to the battery wires of the Suburban (with jumper cables): the starter barely spins a little bit, and the jumper cables get very hot at the clamps and smoke a bit, especially the ground cable! So, same problem...
I have also connected both jumper cables directly to the starter, the + to the big lug nut, the ground to the case: still the same!
When I have installed the TBI on this engine, I have not touched the starting circuit of the Suburban, and it started before!
One last thing: the starter keeps on turning (very slowly) even after I release the ignition key; same if I try to hot-wire the small terminal. Could this be of interest?
I find this all very frustrating, because if I put juice to the Suburban, the battery wires start smoking, and if I do not give it juice, I cannot search where the problem is!!!
Thanks!

Well, here are the news...
First, I have a new battery, the old one would not hold the charge, although it tested good at the parts store...
Second, my good old trusty jumper cables were shot!!! With the old cables, nothing, even with the new battery; with the new cables, the starter spins... Could someone come and kick my [censored], please?
Thanks for your help, guys!

Dan, with my new battery, I have done your test...
With jumper between battery+ and starter solenoid (small lug), the light comes on very strong... Connected to the big lug on the starter, the light comes on very dim...
BUT, if I disconnect the wire that goes to the small lug (from the ignition key) and connect the testlight to the wire, no light; if I hook the testlight to the small lug, the light comes on strong. Am I right to think that the problem is in the starter, then? Does this call for a new starter, or?...
The starter tested good (although a bit noisy, the guy said) at the parts store a few days ago...

Solved, I think!
It turns out I had 3 problems at the same time, simple, basic problems but on top of each others:
the battery in the Suburban was actually dead, would not hold the charge: put a new one in;
my battery cables were shot, for some reason, they had been good to me for 15 years but now, they could not carry the current anymore...;
I had to add a new ground cable, between engine block and battery, which is funny since my truck was starting fine before, without this cable...
Now the starter spins fine!
Thanks for your help, it has kept me going and I have learned a few things along the way!