The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Engine keeps dieing out ('54 P/U 235)

I have a 235 that starts right up and sounds fairly good at idle.

But even at start up I hear a very slight hic up at idle and when RPM is raised pretty high there is a loss or something like it's not getting enough of something.

After about 10-15 minutes that "loss" strangling off comes down into the lower RPMs until it finally dies out.

After about 10 minutes the engine will start back up and dies out threw the same process.

Two things to note:
Fuel delivery system is good and clean.

Generator, battery and voltage regulator are shot.

Any ideas?


TIA and Adios, Kip

Might be a non-vented gas cap.

Thanks Cletis gas cap is vented.
Tell Aunte Bea Hey and all that.

Adios, Kip

It's just a guess, but maybe the heat riser on the manifold(right under the carburetor) isn't working right.

vacuum advance not working? vacuum leak that gets worse with heat?

Bill

Has it started since you put the 8 volt battery in?

It could even be something in the ignition circuit acting up when cold. I don't know.

Does it still have points?

You said that the fuel sys. is clean but it sounds like a bad fuel filter , did You check the voltage at the battery as it is dying , put Your meter on the battery at start up than check as it's running . If the voltage goes lower as it is running it would be Your charging sys not putting voltage (+ amps ) back into Your battery.


Pete

Colter-Riser is good, Thanks.

Squeeze-I *Think* vacuum advance is good, it is moving with acceleration. I don't *think* there's any leaks But I will triple check it, Thanks.

Colter-battery, generator, voltage regulator are wasted I *think*. There's NO charging going on. Shouldn't these old vehicles be able to run without vdc? Thanks.

***Colter-"It could even be something in the ignition circuit acting up when cold I don't know." It's Not "cold" here. Points? Plugs? Condenser? All have about 500 miles on them *But* I've been laying on the starter alot lately tryin to get this thing running. But like I said I *Can* get it running and it starts up and idles good and even accelerates decent for about 10 minutes with messed up electrical system (as stated above), Thanks.

Colter-Yes it has points, Thanks.

Pete-Gas tank to intake is all good. Battery is shot, truck will start with jump and run on it's own for about 10 minutes, Thanks.



***Colter- Points, Condenser, Plugs-Ignition Circuit- they're fairly new. But I've been hangin on the starter Alot lately.***
Sound maybe like a problem? Anybody else?


TIA and Adios, Kip

as the truck runs, if the voltage is dropping when the coil gets to a certain voltage it will not run right than at a lower voltage it will just stop running , try keeping a charger on it as it's running and see if it keeps going.

Pete

Twice,you have mentioned the battery/charging system is shot.How about addressing this.The ignition will want a good source of power.

no juice, no spark. No spark, no bang.

You need fuel, compression and spark to keep the suck-squish-bang-blow going.

This sounds suspiciously like a problem I once experienced on a Pontiac. The fuel line ran very close to the head. Once the engine got good and warmed up, it would die off because it was starving for fuel. The cause is called vapor lock. The gas actually boils in the line and turns to vapor that is at higher pressure than the fuel pump can overcome, starving the engine for fuel and killing it off.

To troubleshoot, run the motor until it starts exhibiting the symptoms, then spray some electronic parts cleaner on the fuel line where it runs near the manifold or head. (Electronic parts cleaner comes out of the can colder than all get out.) If the motor responds immediately, you've found the source of your problem.

The solution is to move the fuel line away from the head and/or intake. Usually you can do this by bending the line, but you might want to secure it with some standoffs so it can't move back.

If this ain't it, I ain't got a clue.

Diagnosis by notes is tough, but I had a similar sounding problem with my ’53 235. It would start and run ok but would not idle below 1200 RPM. If I tried to idle it lower the engine would slowly loose RPM until at about 500 it would just die.

It seems to be fixed now. The culprit was a vacuum leak at the wiper motor. Mine has a separate speed control for the wiper, it is attached directly to the motor itself with a very short tube and this was leaking.

I believe what was happening was

My timing was set a little late (Power glide engine with an older stick shift flywheel)
The engine running at a high idle was actually running on the centrifugal advance and not the vacuum because of the vacuum leak.
As the idle started to come down the centrifugal advance went to zero and without it or the vacuum advance the timing was just too late to sustain life.

Kip to Kip-"Diagnosis by notes is tough"-No Lie Huh? But yeah kind of what Squeeze was sayin Check For A Leak. Yep I got to check that wiper tube, Thanks.

Scott-Yep, I got gas, it's the spark that I'm thinkin about If Kip's idea doesn't help. And that will lead me to...

Pete's charger idea, Thanks.

BC-I know I should just go in a put a 12 volt system in there as per 5th Avenue But I just don't have the coin right now and I have all these other old 6 and 8 volt parts lieing around that I am tryin to make work, Thanks.


Adios, Kip

Kip,

Balder-Dash, Poppy-Cock, and HarUmph, I say, to the 12-volt comment. The problem isn't that it's a 6-volt system, the problem is that it's a 6-volt system that's in need of repair! Find the problem, fix it, and move on.

Now . . . what was the problem? . . .

Oh yeah, right . . . the "get up and go" gets up and goes after 10 minutes. Hmmm . . . I like the "leave the charger on it while it runs" idea. It's definitely time to get out the volt-meter. See what voltage at the battery is when running, check it at the regulator. Then, how about a "full-Field" test, to check the generator?

My regulator started acting a whole lot better recently after I doused it with contact cleaner from Radio Shack. The shop manual will have all sorts of tests for the regulator and electrical system.

AND, tightening the "coming loose" wire from the ignition to the coil helped heaps, also! Always good to follow the electron path, and check all wires and connections.

Stick with it, it will turn up sooner or later . . .

-Michael

"Stick with it, it will turn up sooner or later . . . ", Thanks Michael.

I'm going to keep fuel delivery system as far from heat as possible, check the wiper hose, and run it with the charger hooked up.

Nobody thinks it the plugs or points huh?

I'm going to take a break though, too darn hot and my Wife's riding my but too much about the house smelling like exhaust and my daughters jump on the band wagon with her (I Hate That!!!) And oh yeah I got to work.


Thanks Guys and Adios, Kip

Yep,

Some days, between daughters, wives, and work, it's like there's no room for fun in life!!!