The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop What viscosity oil should I be using in my 216?

I tried the search function, but found nothing on this. I've got a '48 half-ton with the original 216 in it. Simple question - should I be using a straight weight oil, or is a 10w-30 okay? What do you use in your stovebolt?

You'll get as many answers as there are 'bolt members. I did a search using "oil viscosity" and got 20 pages of hits @ 50 hits per page. Not all were germane but a bit of looking will get you what you seek.

Thanks, Tiny. I'll do a search on "oil viscosity."

Tiny, I did the search, and pretty much came up with the same stuff I did when I searched using "engine oil" and "what oil to use." Surprisingly, I didn't find a discussion of what oil to use in a 216, or any older engine.

So, what oil do you use in your 'bolt?

I use 15x40 with the API "L" rating. Before long that won't be possible and I'll have to use "M" oil since about everyone isn't making L oil any longer. Some use 10x30 some use straight weight oil. The reason I said to do a search is this issue has been beat to death in the past.

Opinions are like "noses", or other body parts that smell- - - -and some of them are pretty stinky!

When I was growing up in the 1950's, most of the stovebolt engines used straight SAE 30 oil in the summer, and 20 weight in the winter. Detergent oil was a relatively new development. The conventional wisdom was "Don't switch from non-detergent oil to detergent- - - -it will make the engine use oil". All the detergent really did was clean up a worn-out engine, and let the rings collapse by cleaning the carbon deposits out from under the rings.

Multi-weight oils like 10W-30 don't thicken as they get hot, they just lubricate like the heavier oils as the temperature rises. Using a 10W-30 in an old engine results in less cushioning between parts, and a somewhat noisy engine. I like 20W-50 to retain the thickness of the 20 weight oil, while giving the cold-start flow characteristics of an oil thinner than straight 30. Just my opinion- - - -flame away!
Jerry

Tiny, I thought I'd find all kinds of threads on this subject, but nothing pops out. However, you remember Niagara, don't you? He had that bright yellow '50 and was a frequent poster until he sold the truck a ways back and got a '61 Buick. Anyway, we're still in touch on a regular basis, so I asked him what oil he put in his truck. He sent me this link. I think it explains it very well.

Bob Adler's Oil Article

Hotrod, why would anyone flame you for providing input on a subject like this? I thank you for your contribution.

Hey thanks for that link. It was a little lengthy but well worth the read IMHO! Thanks.

A lot of good info!

It's been a while since he wrote it since he referenced "J" (SJ) oil. As I noted above it's up to SM now. It seems to move in alphabetical order as they change the spec.

Do you know anywhere that the past history of those specs are avalable Tiny?? It might be interesting to see what changes they have made to the oils in the last half century.
I've been running Rotilla T 15W40 from the first day I brought mine home and manage to go through a quart about every 150-200 miles, the oil scrapers are shot. Earlier this summer on a suggestion from someone I switched over to straight Pennzoil 30w to see if it might seal any better. Running through those two gallons of 30W my oil consumption went up to a quart every 75-100 miles. In the last few hundred miles I've gone back to the Rotilla T 15W40 and I'm back up to where I was. GO FIGURE!!!!
Oh, and I will, be pulling the short block for work this winter for sure. I just can't afford the oil any more.

Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

No sorry Denny. I'm not aware of a site that has the past specs. It would be interesting to see where they started. Was it SA?

I copied this from an AMSOIL page:

The API is the American Petroleum Institute. The API maintains a system of Service Classifications (“S” ratings) for gasoline engines and Commercial Classifications (“C” ratings) for diesel engines. The procedures, procedures and policies by which lubricants are rated is a constantly changing system and involves representatives from the major automotive companies, API, oil manufacturers other engineering activities. Periodically changes are made to the specifications to keep up to date with current gasoline and diesel engine technology.

There are many classifications that have become obsolete and are no longer used. For example, occasionally I receive calls from people that have purchased a new piece of equipment stating they have to use a “SE” oil. I explain to them that SE oil specifications began in 1971 and were obsolete with the new SF specifications released in 1981. Today both SE and SF are obsolete. What has most likely happened is that some technical editor or clerk has transcribed portions of a previous service or owners manual to the new manual without completely reviewing it for any errors or updates to specifications.

The specifications referred to in these classifications generally have to do with oxidation protection, high temperature engine deposits, foaming, acid formation, sludge control and rust and corrosion protection. I have listed only the most recent classifications. There are many obsolete specifications that will not be covered in this book. These specifications are constantly changing and are subject to change as new engine, emissions and vehicles and/or government requirements arise. Note that when a new specification is released it makes the previous specification obsolete, therefore when an applications specifies the obsolete lubricant you may use the lubricant with the API classification that has superceded and replaced it

“S”- SERVICE CLASSIFICATIONS FOR GASOLINE ENGINES

SH- For 1994-1996 Gasoline Engine Service (Obsolete)
Classification SH was adopted in 1992 and recommended for gasoline engines in passenger cars and light trucks starting in 1993 model year. This category supercedes the performance requirements of API SG specification for 1989-1992 models, which is now obsolete. Applications that call for an API service classification SG can use the SH specification. The specification addresses issues with deposit control, oxidation, corrosion, rust and wear and replaces.

SJ- For 1997-2001 Gasoline Engine Service (Current Spec.)
Classification SJ was adopted in 1996 and recommended for gasoline engines in passenger cars and light trucks starting in 1997 model year. Applications specifying API SH can use the newer API SJ service classification. Note that where applicable certain letters in the sequence will be skipped to prevent confusion with other standards. In this case, SI was skipped since industrial oils are currently rated according to SI classifications.

SL- For 2001-2004 Gasoline Engine Service- (Current Spec.)
Recommended for gasoline engines in passenger cars and light trucks starting in July 2001. SL oils are engineered to provide improved high temperature deposit control and lower oil consumption. Applications specifying API SJ can use the new API SL service classification. Note that some SL rated oils may also meet the latest ILSAC specification and/or qualify as energy conserving. SL is the latest specification.

SM- For 2004 and newer Gasoline Engine Service Automotive Engines (Current Spec)

This specification was introduced in Nov. 2004. SM oils are engineered to provide improved oxidation resistance, improved deposit and wear protection and improved low temperature performance. Note that some SM rated motor oils may also meet the current ILSAC specification.

Here's a link that has the history of the API ratings, plus a lot of other good information about motor oil:

Second Chance Garage Article

Here's another question. Why is it called "motor oil?" We use it in engines, not motors.

That's just what I was looking for Tom, haven't had a chance to digestit all but it looks like it answers what I was wondering about.
Thanks
DG

OK, does anyone remember the rating system BEFORE the API ratings?

"ML" (Motor Light) Gasoline engines, light duty service. This one was the traditional non-detergent stuff in the 1940's and early 50's. It was often sold from 1-quart glass bottles with screw-on tin funnels, transferred from a 55 gallon "bulk oil" drum.

"MM" (Motor Medium) Slightly heavier-duty oil, usually sold in sealed cans, still non-detergent, I believe.

"MS" (Motor Severe) Straight weight high detergent oils, and the earliest of the multi-viscosity oils like RPM "10-30 Special".

"DG" (Diesel General) General-service oil for small and medium-sized Diesel engines. Usually similar detergent qualities as MS, but with somewhat higher film strength for Diesel rod bearings under high compression loads.

"DS" (Diesel Severe) Highest quality hi-detergent oil available, intended for large Diesel engines under heavy-load highway and off-road use. RPM DELO (Diesel Engine Lubricating Oil) was one of the top oils in the mid to late 1950's. Usually a straight-weight oil, but 15W40 DELO became available in the late 60's.
Jerry

Not that this is of any real help to the original poster, but this is what the 1953 Chevy Truck Owner's Manual was recommending. I'm not sure that I would want to use a 20W or even a 20 oil in a truck in the summer.

When I was working in a Texaco station in the late fifties, we stocked a 10W, a 20W-20, a 30, and 10W-30. We did not stock a 20W or 20. There was still a lot of mistrust of "multi-viscosity" oils such as the 10W-30, but not of 20W-20. As I recall, the 10W and 30 oils were labeled "ML-MM" and the multi-viscosity oils were "MS-DG", but my memory may be playing tricks on me.

Lots of interesting information has been posted this time.

Hoyt

I'm the original poster, Hoyt. I also have an owner's manual for my '48, and the oil recommendations are similar. My father, who's 83 and a former mechanic, is stuck in the old days as far as the oil issue is concerned. I sent him the Bob Adler article and he begrudgingly agreed that 10W-30 is okay for my 216.

When my old man had his service station, he had a dinosaur tied up out back, and when they needed a quart of oil, they went out back and squeezed it fresh.

Just a thought. Try some oil for air-cooled engines. If it works in a high compression Harley or 3 1/2 horse Briggs, why not an old 216?

Tom, I bet your old man worked at a Sinclair Gas Station.

No, it was a Gulf on Broadway in North Albany, Tim. The Sinclair was further up Broadway in Menands. As a kid I always liked the Sinclair sign. I didn't know why they had a dinosaur, but I liked it anyway.