Hi all, I'm new here. Tried doing an intro in the welcome center, but it wouldn't let me. I've got a '62 Chevy C-10 with a 235 and 3 on the tree.
I did a search and have been reading up on the whole 235 oil system and I'm still confused. When I got my truck it had an AC oil filter. I didn't have room for it anymore so I plugged the the holes on the block and have been running it without a filter. I'd like to run a filter again, but want to convert to a spin on filter. I don't think my block was modified for "full-flow" oiling so I'm assuming I need a bypass type filter. I mainly drive my truck on weekends, so it doesn't see a lot of miles. Here are my questions:
1. Is a filter necessary since this is a bypass system and not all the oil gets filtered? -There seems to be a debate on this one.
2. I was planning on using a Trans-Dapt remote filter bracket, would this work for my application?
3. If I do install a filter, what type of spin-on filter do I need? I'm assuming I can't just screw on a Fram PH8A or similar.
4. What size oil line do I need? From what I've read, I'm guessing I need to run something small like stock?
Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I just need some clarification.
A filter isn't 100% necessary, but IMOP, I'd rather have one than not. But I do drive mine as a daily driver. As to which one, the Trans-Dapt remote will work fine, I beleive that there's at least one member here that has used one. Use the same size lines as stock (1/4") to keep the oil flow the same. As to what element to run, that will depend on what the adapter calls for, most do use the PH8A style filter (a MoPar fitment, as I recall).
Here are some things I've learned about the bypass filter system:
1.The bypass filter actually filters about 10% of the engine oil and dumps it back into the sump with the dirty oil.
2.You loose about 5-7 psi of oil pressure to the bearings by using the bypass system.
3. You can run a remote relocation filter using the base that is threaded for a Ford/Chrysler 3/4X16 TPI (Puralator PL30001 or Fram PH8A if you can't get a good filter). These filters have a built-in bypass valve.
4. The lines you run to the relocated filter mount must stay the same ID as the stock lines or you will bleed off additional pressure from the bearings. The fittings are 1/8NPT.
5. All relocation mounts that I've seen have been 1/2NPT so there are going to be major reducers to get the 1/2NPT down to the 1/8NPT fitting size.
I've run the bypass, removed it and picked up 5-7 psi of oil pressure and had my engine drilled for a full-flow system at rebuild time. If this was just an occasional driver, I would suggest you consider foregoing the bypass and just change your oil at 2K miles. You'll be dollars and cents ahead in the long run and your engine will be much happier with the additional oil pressure. Of course the call is yours.
Is your engine a 62 - 235? Isn't a 62 - 235 a full pressure engine? If so, you would need a regular oil filter set up, not a by pass.
Joe :crazy:
"Truckin' Around .......... Since 1937!" My name is Joe and I am addicted to Classic Country Music. I just can't hep myself. Operators are standing by to take your calls! Now cruising in the Passing Lane
1954-1962 235 (and 261) engines were high-pressure oil system engines (as apposed to the low-pressure oil lubrication system in all 216 engines and in all 1941-1953 235 truck engines).
No 235 engine had a full-flow oil filter. All low-pressure and high-pressure 235 engines used an optional by-pass oil filter.
The 1958-1962 Chevrolet truck 261 engines had a full-flow oil filter.
1: I lost no oil pressure. 2: All of the oil get filtered, just not every time through the engine. 3: Any filtering is better than none. 4: When I bought my remote filter adapter I simply purchased a spin on filter that fit. 5: The lines I use are 5/16" since the "Ts" involved are 1/4", using a larger line will gain you nothing.
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If you're concerned about oil pressure drop, simply fabricate an orfice into the return line from the filter to restrict the flow back into the oil pan. I use Holley carburetor jets. By changing the size of the jet I can adjust the oil pressure up or down to suit the situation, and still get enough flow through the filter to clean up the oil adequately. Another option would be to use the Frantz filter with the toilet paper cartridge, and let the cartridge control the flow to a trickle. That system cleans dirt particles down to 2/10 micron, or 0.0002". Filter media that size MUST be used as a bypass system, because it can't flow enough volume to keep the bearings lubed on a full-flow setup. Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
Non-detergent oil was used in engines without filters, as the particles dropped to the bottom of the pan forming sludge, which needed to be cleaned often. When detergent oils became more popular, remote filters where used to trap the particles, now suspended in the oil.
Remote filters are very efficient in catching even the smallest particles (down to 1/10 micron in case of the Frantz filters). About 10-20% picked up by the oil pump gets diverted into the remote filter and it takes only a few minutes for the entire engine oil to be filtered.
The advantage with full flow filters is that all the oil picked up by the pump is filtered first, before going to the moving parts. However to keep pressure high, these filters only trap particles around 20 microns at best.
Big rigs today use both types of filter systems for maximum protection.
I got a remote filter on my 1962 235 and a full flow spin on filter on my 1962 261. If I disconnect the remote filter I still get the same oil pressure. I don't like the fram spin on filter designs and prefer NAPA's gold 1060 filter with anti-drain back valve. I got a frantz system for the 261 as well, but didn't want to drill into my brand new engine, so come spring, I will replace the original 235 remote filter with the more efficient frantz and use the existing lines.
For my daily drivers I use SAE 30 straight grade detergent oil with enough zinc content (1200 ppm). My valve cover is connected to the air filter, to keep the smallest dirt and dust particles outside of the engine. Breather caps use foam filters, which are not as efficient. Change oil every 2000-3000 miles and avoid short runs in cold or humid weather. This should keep the oil and filters free (for the most part) of harmful contaminants.
Resurecting this old post as I'm new to this forum and need further clarification. Hopefully I don't break any rules.hanks so much for helping and all the work you do to provide this info. Just Amazing. I'm trying help out a friend with oil change on 1958 GMC 300 with L6. The filter housing and lines appears stock, though I've never seen them like this. Housing is mounted on right side and the lines are old fiber type, then solid brass crimps to steel lines. The steel lines appear to be factory bent around timing cover along with line to cyl head and fuel line. All crimped and bent together perfectly. The filter housing shaft only has a hole at the very bottom. A washer was on the bottom followed by a tapered spring, then the filter. This would just lift the filter off the bottom allowing oil past the filter? I"m thinking the spring and washer go on top and oil would then overflow (bypass) over the top of filter if couldn't keep up ? Diameter about 4 1/4" by 6" high. 1/2' drain plug. I retired from being a mechanic 20 years ago and this is frustrating me to no end. So what filter housing is this (L5?) and what AC or wix filter does it take? Purchase a wix 51121, but there would only be steel to steel contact at the bottom, so thinking that filter isn't correct. The fiber hose burst so just replaced with copper pipe for now as photo will show. Does anyone have the filter mounted on the right side of engine? Here is a link to photos. Hopefully it will open https://photos.app.goo.gl/x278FW8CjEZgBBxM8 Thanks for any help!
I apologize to the forum for adding other info to this topic.
Someone has removed the road draft tube and installed a PVC valve and hose. Not smart. The draft tube is also the oil fill. I can provide pictures of an original GMC PVC system. Also, that is a Rochester B carburetor for Chevrolet (leakchester). GMC mostly used Zenith and a few Holley. Which cubic inch Chevy engine Rochester on which cubic inch GMC engine?
Last edited by buoymaker; 07/11/202211:23 AM.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
Does it really matter which size lines you use to feed and exit the bypass filter as long as there is an appropriately sized (1/16”) restriction orifice somewhere in the circuit?
In my simple brain, the orifice becomes the limitation regardless the ID of the lines used.
kyis Really appreciate your post and those pictures look like my stuff except a lot cleaner,my daily is covered with oily bean dust. However I am proud of my bearing roll-in job,all -.002 mains and rods to shut-up a bearing noise. About 10,000 miles since that job.Somehow got by that rear main seal problem,so just moderate oil leaks on the concrete !!
buoymaker I just marvel at the carburetor circus,now I love to mess with these tractor engines but I want to cruise my old truck,not throw money at hard to fix antique fuel and ignition systems.
I have a scanned version ( a .PDF ) of the 1958 "Operating Your New GMC Truck" comic-book style manual that came in the glove compartment of the new '58 trucks. These books were pretty fragile and are not reproduced as far as I know. Let me know where to e-mail it to you or your friend.
The GMC Master Parts Book calls for an AC P-112 element for the L1 type filter (used on smaller trucks) and an AC P-117 element for the S2 type filter used on larger trucks. The P-112 crosses to a Wix 51001 and NAPA 1001. There are no pictures of the either filter in the 55-60 GMC Master Parts Book, but the 39-53 MPB has this picture of the L-1 filter, which is likely NOT the one on your friend's truck. Current 51001 filter elements have a wire handle on the top that makes it easier to remove.
Last edited by Bill Hanlon; 07/11/20221:35 PM.
'57 GMC 102, Original 347 V8, HydraMatic, 3.08 rear gear, added A/C, disk front brakes, HEI, AFB carb, '98 Honda Black Currant paint. T-boned and totaled 10/12 '52 GMC 152 Stake Bed, Original 228, SM420, added A/C, HEI, disk front brakes, '67 Chev 3.55 rear gear. Gets used as a real truck.
JW51, old well worn engines can have a sludge build-up and larger particles can free up and be passed along through the passages. Using a tiny tube for oil flow is asking for a clot. Just like humans, a clot can lead to disaster. I would not use larger (than stock) tubes because that delays oil getting to the oil canister. The best place for the bypass restriction is after filtration and in the location that was originally designed.
Not my pictures.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
Sorry, one more thing. The original NOS filters can rust even though they have been sitting on the shelf for decades. Buy a new replacement type. Chevrolet bypass filters are 5 micron filtration which is finer than full pressure filters.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
Sorry, one more thing. The original NOS filters can rust even though they have been sitting on the shelf for decades. Buy a new replacement type. Chevrolet bypass filters are 5 micron filtration which is finer than full pressure filters.
I don’t know that I posted about it, but I recently “geeked out” on filtration and did some research. Happy to be proven wrong, but it would appear that the commonly available “new” offerings from Wix and Fram for our canister style bypass systems᠁.are rated at parody, or worse, than modern full flow filters.
My current belief is that NOS (but not so old to be rusty) filter elements are the best bet if you want to actually filter like a bypass should. If I am limited to filtering a small percentage of the total flow, coarse filtering doesn’t make sense to me.
Other alternatives to get fine filtration would be a modern spin-on bypass or one of the “toilet paper” units.
There is so much confusing misinformation contained in this old post that the thread should be deleted altogether to keep someone from destroying an engine by following some of the advice here without having a good understanding about how a bypass filter works. There is a tiny flow control orfice in the standpipe of the original filter housing that controls oil flow (and pressure drop), so if the system is converted to a spin-on type filter, that restrictor orfice must be included somewhere inline between the filter adapter and the return line to the oil pan. For really effective filtering it would be necessary to run both a full flow and a bypass filter, one to strain out the "big chunks" before they get to the bearings, and another, much finer media filter to remove the fine particles that the full flow can't trap. 855 cubic inch Cummins Diesels used to use that system. A filter for Diesel fuel or hydraulic fluid would be a good choice for removing the fine stuff. Few, if any people choose to go that route. Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
