The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Opinions wanted: Hard Starting 235/Carter YF

Until last summer I had a (leaky) Rochester B on my 235. I would pull out the choke cable, give the accelerator pedal two presses, then crank it and it would run without incident.

I've since changed over to a (non-leaky) Carter YF. I can't get the engine to start. It turns over very well, there is a full bowl of fuel in the filter just upstream of the carb, but it just cranks and cranks without firing up no matter what I do with the accelerator pedal.

If I take off the top of the oil bath and shoot a small squirt of starter fluid then key the engine, it fires up right away and runs fine. This makes me believe that it isn't spark.

After warming up, I can turn off the engine and restart it without incident for the next couple hours or so. All I do is pull out the choke cable, give it a few pumps of the pedal, and press the starter.

My brother-in-law suggested I replace the accelerator pump inside the carb.

Does this sound reasonable? Any other suggestions what the trouble could be?

Thanks in advance.
Bill

B-I-L has it nailed. I buy the pump seperate at NAPA, P/N 2-4218. I really don't know but I suspect it may be the same # for all YF's. I'd buy their rebuild kit, give them your carb# for that, & do it all while I'm at it, you'll need the gaskets anyway, but you still need this # as its not included in the rebuild kit.
Doug

Hey, thanks a lot Doug. I appreciate the opinion as well as the part numbers. I didn't rebuild the YF when I got it. I just installed it and waited to see what would happen. Aside from the initial start-up, it ran well aside. Guess it is time to open'er up and do the rebuild.

Bill

Is the choke functional?

Accelerator pump may be helpful, but definately not necessary to start the engine if the choke is functional.

Doug, there are several different diaphragms used in the various YF Carters.

If the diaphragm is defective, engine will probably not run well, as fuel could syphon through the diaphragm.

But a rebuild may be useful.

Jon.

Thanks Jon - That tip about fuel siphoning I never thought of, its a good one to remember.
Doug

Thanks for weighing-in, Jon. Yes, I believe the choke is fully functional. When it gets cranked and the choke is out, I get a nice'n'high idle speed. If I push back in, it slows down. If I push in the choke before the engine has had a chance to warm up, it'll die. If I wait until it is warm, it purrs at low idle. (If I remember correctly, it is a 2100S.)

Once I have the engine running, it runs really fine. My problem is that critical stage between cranking and idling! It doesn't matter if I give it two presses on the accelerator pedal or 50- it just won't "grab." If I add a spritz of starter fluid, VROOM no problem.

Pretty low-tech description of what is going on, I realize. Do you think this changes things or would you still be suspicious of the accelerator pump? Would fuel siphoning be a possibility even though the glass bowl appears to be full?

A rebuild is definitely planned.

Bill

It is possible that the modern fuel is evaporating out of the bowl, which would cause the pump not to function.

Do you have any hesitation when pulling away from a stop sign. Hesitation could indicate a defective pump.

When cold cranking, try this: crank the engine about 6~8 seconds. Stop cranking and pump the footfeed 3 or 4 times. Now pump the choke, and crank again. If the bowl is low of fuel, cranking for 6~8 seconds should fill the bowl, and allow the pump (if functional) to operate normally.

Jon.

Jon-
* No hesitation when pulling from a stop. I really haven't noticed any acceleration problems, either from a stop or when climbing a hill.

* I don't know if this has any relevance but I use super unleaded, ~ 92 octane gasoline. I'm not using any additives, just straight pump.

* Thanks for the cold-cranking suggestion. I'll try it tonight when I get home and see how it reacts. My prediction is that there will be no change in my problem. I've done a similar approach, cranking the 6 - 8 seconds, and then pumped the accelerator pedal about 20 times. Granted, I never thought to pump the choke, but upon re-cranking, still no start. The fuel filter bowl shows filled with fuel before cranking and after.

I'll report later on what my results are when I try your suggestion. Thanks.

Bill

the fact that it works fine for a while after once starting would make me suspect the battery - could be a coincidental thing, cooler weather meaning slightly slower cranking, no start ... jump the battery on the first try start and see if faster cranking makes it fire off .... cold starting can be a problem with even slightly weaker spark

and lay off the high test, it's wasted $$ for a 235

Bill

I've got a Carter YF on my '46 216 which I rebuilt a couple months ago due to starting issues. It functions extremely well now. You shouldn't have to pump the accelerator at all to get your truck started. I don't on mine. I just pull the choke out all the way and hit the starter. She fires off every time. If its cold instead of 2-3 seconds its maybe 5-7 seconds to fire her up! I also spend the extra money and burn high test. A rebuild should definately help!!

I need to re-read my posts! Pump the choke??? I meant AFTER cranking a few seconds so that you know there is fuel in the bowl to pump the footfeed, thus working the accelerator pump.

Must have been "hand to eye" coordination on my typing??? Or maybe a "senior moment"!

Jon.

Bill: I feel confident that I have ample battery power. The engine turns over very well, even after 30 - 45 seconds of stomping. I think the significant thing is that I can crank it and crank it without starting no matter how much I wear out my leg pumping the accelerator pedal, but if I give it a little squirt of starter fluid it starts instantly.

Being uncertain that the recent cold temps could have taken some of the oomph out of the battery, I got a trickle charger last weekend and left it hooked up. When I give it a try this evening, it'll be with a fully charged battery so hopefully that will take it out of the equation.

Jon: I'm glad you clarified that. I've never heard of "pumping the choke", but assumed that I just wasn't familiar with the jargon. I thought you were wanting me to cycle the choke from off to full, then off and back to full. Y'know, "pumping the choke!"

When I'm cranking, I'm pumping the accelerator pedal like crazy. I've learned that one long 30-second crank isn't as good as five 6-second long cranks. If it doesn't grab after the first few seconds, it isn't going to start on that attempt. If, during the attempt, it coughs a little but fails to grab, then I stand a fairly good chance of having success if I stop that attempt and start again. As winter drags on, the success rate seems to be dropping which prompted me to post the question in this forum. I don't know if the worsening problem is due to colder temperature or something wearing out over time.

Bill

TxLaTx,

It sure seems to me that if the truck idles fine after starting, doesn't hesitate around town when the accelerator is pushed and starts OK when warm that all in the carburetor department is fine.

Although I wouldn't think 'battery', with this set of circumstances I sure would think marginal ignition. The starting fluid will ignite MUCH easier than a fuel/air mixture.

This might have you thinking you aren't getting any fuel when in reality, spark is so poor that the standard fuel/air mix when cold won't ignite.

If it idles fine when warm it probably isn't the float setting or a plugged jet...if it accelerated when told to, it probably isn't a accelerator pump, and a warm fuel/air mixture might be just over the boundary of being able to start.

Pulling a plug wire and watching the strength of the spark as it jumps to ground when the truck is cold and cranking might give you a clue.

Stuart

I wonder about wear and worn-out parts, Stuart. In my mind (warped as it is!) I wonder about that accelerator pump being worn, or some type of increased friction inside the carb due to temperature-caused shrinkage.

Now that I think about it, I wonder about the coil. If I had plenty of cold cranking amps to turn the engine, but the coil was misbehaving, wouldn't I get turn-over, but poor ignition? I suppose this doesn't address operation once it is running. (If it is a marginally performing coil prior to starting, the coil can't self-heal just because the engine starts, right?)

It really seems to idle fine, cold or warm, once I get it started.

If I pulled that plug wire and watched the spark jump to ground, I wouldn't know if it was "good" or "bad", just there or not. I don't have enough experience to compare it to anything.

I was planning to convert to a Pertronix ignition system later this spring, but this was before these troubles. I'm hesitant to throw another set of variables into the equation at this point. Do you recommend doing a shotgun approach and rebuilding the carb and changing to electronic ignition with the hope that it might get fixed, or would it be better to pinpoint the problem, fix it, then go from there?

Dang, I thought this was going to be easier. It seems the deeper I get, the more possible causes I'm learning.

Bill

find the problem and fix it b4 making any other changes that may only compound the situation ... I can guarantee that when a 235 is cold it MUST have a good spark to fire right off, and it doesn't take much weakening to make it reluctant, when cranking the starter is drawing a lot from the battery, even something as 'trivial' as the ign resistor not being bypassed will prevent it ... check/reset plug and point gap, and check all ign circuit electrical connections, if everything is tickety electrically a 235 should start in a couple revs, if it's got any fuel at all

Bill
and do try a cold start with a boost on, that'll confirm the problem

TxLaTx,

Although I heartily agree with Bill (red58), would it be difficult to stick the Rochester back and and see what happens. Your first post alludes to the fact that this problem came with the carburetor swap.

I can't help but think that a carburetor hard start situation would carry over into a idling or running glitch! Once your rig does get started, it seems to run and accelerate fine...almost.



Stuart

Here's an update:

Got home, took off the trickle charger (showing fully charged) and verified the filter bowl appeared full of fuel. Next I pulled out the choke, pressed the accelerator pedal two times, turned on the ignition, and stomped the starter pedal. Plenty of crank, but no start after 6 seconds. Let off the starter pedal, pressed the accelerator pedal 7 times, then stomped the starter and still no start after 6 seconds.

At this point I wanted to check the spark, but I don't have a helper to stomp the starter while I hold the spark plug wire. I pulled out a remote starter that I recently got from my dad's things after he passed away, but there aren't any instructions how to hook it up, just two clamps. If you can tell me how to hook up the remote starter, I'll be able to watch the spark from the spark plug wire to the ground.

I pulled two plugs just for a look-see. Both of them looked reasonably clean, a little soot but not much. (I'm running 45s.) Both gaps checked in a .035.

If I can get that remote switch running, then I can hook up this little "engine analyzer" to check quite a few diagnostics. Nothing fancy, but it will give me some more information to report concerning points, dwell, etc.

I have to leave tomorrow morning for the weekend for some family stuff. I won't be back until Monday so there won't be any developments until then. Even though I can't DO anything, I can still read this forum.

Stuart: I don't have the B anymore. (I donated it to a fellow 'bolter's efforts to remediate it.) It was somewhat leaky, so I didn't feel comfortable driving with it, but starting was never a problem. Two presses, pull on the choke, stomp for 2 seconds and get ready to roll! After I swapped to the (un-rebuilt) YF last spring, I noticed less ease in starting. As time wears on it has been getting steadily worse.

Once the truck is warmed up, it tends to start okay. I'm not saying it is "two presses & go", but certainly nothing as bad as it is when cold.

Next week I'll check through the ignition system. Any way to check the coil?

Thanks for all of your replies and suggesitons. I'm taking them all very seriously. I want to get this thing running like it used to!

Bill

can't use the remote starter on a foot stomp, it's pure mechanical, need to get a honkin big screw driver to wedge against the underside of cab to press the button, but of course if you've got the key on so spark shows, the engine might start so make sure it's in neutral with the brake set

Bill

OK, just re-read the entire thread.

One thing that comes to mind is the use of high-test fuel. Why are you using this? Octane is a measure only of the speed of the ignition of the fuel; nothing else. Higher octane fuel ignites SLOWER than lower octane, thus helping to avoid detonation in high compression engines. It also requires more spark for starting. There is absolutely NO more energy in high-test than in regular, and depending on how much deathanol has been added to increase the octane, maybe significantly LESS energy. At best, the use of this fuel in a stock 235 is a waste of money.

I think regular fuel will help the cold start problem.

In the meantime (prior to burning the high-test out of the tank); it would be interesting to know the condition of a plug immediately after you tried and failed to start the engine. A wet plug might indicate poor ignition, a dry plug might indicate no fuel.

Another test we have used to prove or disprove poor ignition is the use of a second battery. Hook one battery only to the starter, and the second battery to the ignition system. The starter will lower ignition voltage. A second, but not quite so revealing method, would be to have your truck battery fully charged, and simply add a fully charged "jumper" battery with jumper cables. This way, the starter will only drop the voltage by maybe half of what would be dropped by using the single battery.

And I would agree completely with Bill, throwing modifications at a problem only introduces an additional level of uncertainty; fix the problem first.

And while it may be entirely coincidental, 90 plus percent of customers who call us with "carburetor" problems on older vehicles have an electronic conversion in their distributor??? I personally go the other way. My own very high performance vehicle has the HEI removed, and a genuine GM points and condensor distributor installed. Yes, it does require me to occasionally change points, condensor, and plugs; but it has not failed yet.

Jon.

Bill: Thanks for clearing up the remote starter question. I last used it back in the 80s on another car, and couldn't for the life of me remember how it was hooked up. There is only about 8" of separation between the clamps, and I couldn't find anything that look like the "right" place! When I was under the hood attempting to engage the stomp linkage to energize the starter, I must have checked for neutral and e-brake 10 times! I kept imagining myself getting launched under the wheels once I bumped the starter!

Jon: I've been going with super in my bolt thinking that its octane level is probably closer to '58 gasoline than today's blends. I figured if I'm using factory-specs for plug, gap, etc., I might as well be using fuel that the factory figured I'd be using. I know better than to use super for "power" or "mileage." I never had knocking problems regardless of fuel type. I'll go back to regular (87 octane, ~5% ethanol) next tank, per your suggestion and Bill's.

Last night, when I checked gap, it was after two unsuccessful starting attempts. Both plugs appeared dry.

I don't know how old the plugs, condensor, and points are. I verified plug and point gap last spring, and also hooked that little analyzer up and found the dwell to be good. I can't remember each analyzer test I performed, but I remember doing all available and that only idle needed to be adjusted. (Lowered it from 600 rps to 450 rpms.)

At the start of this topic, I was set to a carb rebuild. Now I'm thinking maybe I should replace points, plugs, and the condensor, tackling the issue from the spark standpoint rather than the fuel/accelerator pump side of the equation.

One more question: if I opened the choke and put a puff of starting fluid down the carb and then tried my first start, would that prove anything? I don't think it eliminates anything electrically, but what about carb-wise?

Bill

Bill,

The 'dry plugs' deal sure makes the carburetor look like the guilty party. I don't know if you can further analyze this by squirting starting fluid down the carb.

You know there is a problem, at this point do you need to pinpoint it 100%. A rebuild kit for the carburetor is probably pretty inexpensive, and you indicated you wanted to rebuild it anyway.

This could fix the problem. If this doesn't fix the problem, you are still ahead of the game with your "new carburetor". The points, condenser, cap and rotor route doesn't break the bank either. Now you have both angles to the problem covered...it should start like a champ!

If it still doesn't start easily, it's time to restart the troubleshooting process.

This is a optimists view of how it should work!

Stuart

i will start with an old saying that i have heard most carburetor
problems are electrical. i have found this to be true many times.
its usually the points or the coil and maybe the timing. if your engine starts and runs well and takes the gas i would have to say its in the fire. also be sure to check for vacumm leaks. philip

Can you verify that the choke is actually closing when you pull on the cable? If it doesn't close all the way, it isn't doing squat while you crank and it won't be pulling fuel out of the bowl. Try removing the air cleaner and holding your hand over the carb while you crank it, this will act like a choke to pull in fuel. (Be prepared to remove your hand when it fires)


Also make sure your float bowl level is adjusted correctly, you may not not have enough vacuum at cranking to pull fuel out of the bowl.

Stuart- The starting fluid is what gets my engine running. I try all these different twists on getting the engine started with no luck, but if I put a puff of starter fluid down the throat, it cranks up and runs great. It seems I can't quite get "over the hump" when cranking.

4onthFloor: The choke works fine, I think. Once I get it started with the fluid, I have good idle at high rpms. After a few minutes, I can push in the choke and the engine idles fine at low rpms.

The short version of the problem is that it won't cold start unless it has a spritz of starter fluid, then it runs fine. It also seems to start fine for an hour or two after warming up.

I have to start someplace. I'm out of town now, but I think when I get back I'm going to begin with a carb rebuild kit and replace the accelerator pump/gasket (only) and see the effects. That was my brother-in-law's first suggestion and also got some positive feedback here in forum. Since I'll be dealing with him for the rest of our lives, so I think I owe it to him to start with his suggestion.

The cautions to only tinker with one thing at a time are well-taken. Progressing down the fault tree, next I'll rebuild the rest of the carb, then replace points/condensor, then spark plugs, then decide from there whether to go coil, wires, or whatever. I think at this point I have too many possibilities and I need to start eliminating some. I'll report back later with what I find.

Thanks to all for your inputs. This is what makes Stovebolt.com great!

Bill

Update: FLAPS didn't have the carb kit in-stock, had to order it. The kit, along with points and condenser, are due to arrive ~ Thursday. I'm hoping to have a busy Friday. I'll post more when I have more to report.

Bill

Bill

I have put 1958 235 motor into my 1952 truck and have the same problem as you exactly described and my intermediate solution is to put some gas from top of the carbuerator and cranks rightup and idles, runs and restarts fine for couples of hr. I am going to watch your thread for my troubleshoot and If I do hit a solution, I will surely update this thread

Ganesh

UPDATE:

I picked up points, condenser, and a carb kit at the FLAPS. I also picked up a little spark ignition checker from Harbor Freight. This is a doo-hickey that looks like a plastic spark plug with a little light in it, and then has a boot on the other end. The idea is to mount this in series with a spark plug. When you are getting fire, the little bulb should light. It was only a few bucks; I thought it might show something.

I had time in the day to install the new condenser and points. I didn't see anything wrong with the old ones, just thought it would be a good idea to replace. After replacing, still no change to my problem: the truck cranks, but doesn't start. I didn't try the starter fluid because I wanted to keep the engine bay cool.

I put on the ignition checker on the #1 plug- I saw a dim orange flash. I assume this means I have spark. This was when I was cranking the engine.

I pulled off the carb and did a rebuild. I found that the float wasn't set right when I pulled it apart. Otherwise, everything looked good by my eyes.

I read a thread about carb spacer gaskets while getting back to THIS thread to post this update. I put on the gasket between the carb and the insulator spacer. Based on the thread I read, I'll pull it off tomorrow. (For the record, the old one had a gasket on it too, and it ran fine. Granted, was hard to start, but once running, ran great.)

Here's the rub- no matter what I do, including having starter fluid, I can't get the truck to start. This is different than before. After I tried to start it with the rebuilt carb, it would just crank and crank, but no start. I put on the little ignition checker, and now I can't see any pulsing light at all. Either that thing died after one use (possible- it is Harbor Freight!) or I don't have the slightest spark. This would certainly explain why I now can't start it, even with starter fluid.

I pulled the distributor cap and see that all 6 of the contact points look nice and clean. However, the button in the center is black and rough. I got some 220 sand paper and tried to clean it off a little, but it didn't change the starting problem. (Tomorrow's new cap will eliminate this possible source of the trouble.) The rotor looks great.

I look at my engine, I can think of only two things that could be the problem: the coil or the key switch. I have no idea what to do about the coil. Can I take it to the FLAPS for testing? Is it possible the key switch could be the problem? When I move the key to the ON position, the gas gauge moves. When I stomp on the starter, the amp gage moves. Is it possible that it can energize the meters, but not allow juice to get to the plugs?

Is there a relay in the circuit that could be messed up? I see a litle device on the firewall that could be such a thing.

What the flippin-flip else could it be???

One more thing: after I reinstalled the carb, I failed to crank down on the fuel filter bowl enough to get a good seal. When I was cranking, I was spilling gasoline all around the fuel inlet to the carb. This tells me that the pump is working fine. Also, before completing assembly, I poured some gas in the chamber where the float rests so that it wasn't starting dry. When I disassembled the carb, I verified that the float has no leaks.

I don't have a helper who can help with watching spark jump from the spark plug wire terminal to the block. This is another reason I got the ignition checker.

Does anyone have any idea why it seems I have no spark?

Help! and Thanks!

Bill

Bill,

My guess would be the points are set incorrectly. This is pretty important as it is the switch that allows the coil to build a charge..to saturate its windings. Make sure the pigtail to the condenser is attached properly too.

Stuart

got a meter? batt disconnected, check continuity from the lug on the side of the starter to the coil +, with the key on .... with the foot stomp there's a bypass for the ign resistor, and when you press the start button, full battery voltage is sent to the coil for a little extra uumph - no relay involved, but key sw is

also [battery connected again] you can check spark by pulling the dist cap and opening/closing the points with the key on [other hand in yer pocket ]

sounds like something in the coil circuit

Bill

Also make sure you didn't damage the little pass-through insulator that the points connect to, you will never get a spark if you grounded out the points.

Thanks for responding, guys. I really appreciate it.

Stuart: I turned the engine until the contact was wide open, then used the eccentric to adjust the gap to .019" (shop manual says to use .019" for new points, .016" for old.) THe pig tail and the spring-end of the points are held in place by the pass-through insulator.

Bill: Yes! I have a meter. That is some good advice. I have a question: You are telling me to check the continuity from the lug on the side of the starter to the coil + terminal TWICE, right? As I understand it, I should disconnect the + side of the battery, then check for continuity between the starter and the coil, then reconnect the battery and check again but this time with the key in the ON position. I should get the same results. If not, then I probably have a switch problem because the starter turns when stomped.

4ontheFloor: While I have the meter out, I'll check for continuity between the coil and the INSIDE of the pass through insulator. Shouldn't this verify that I'm not grounded? I can also check for continuity from the outside of the terminal to the top of the rotor when the contact is closed- that would further prove that the insulator/contact circuit is good, right? It wasn't significant that the contact point on the underside of the distributor, where the rotor touches, was crusty black? Maybe I should also check for continuity between the underside of the cap and the end of the coil wire. The new distributor cap that I get today will eliminate this potential source.

Can a FLAPS check a coil for output? What if I learn that I have contnuity, but the coil is failing, giving me a few gigawatts instead of the required 1.21? (That was a joke, sort of. See "Back To The Future" if you don't get it.)

Thanks again, gentlemen. I wasn't expecting to have such a response from the gurus so early on the weekend. I'll report back what I learn.

Bill

no, just check it with battery off [avoid putting current thru the ohmeter], key on [to complete circuit]

what happens is stomping makes the contact to that side terminal live so that full battery power goes to the coil via the key switch, bypassing the ign resistor - with the key on, the circuit should be complete from the lug to the coil

without a helper, you can prop the meter up so you can see it from inside, hook it [volts or current function] between coil and ground, so you can tell if there's power to the coil when cranking

seperately, with everything hooked up and the key on, you should be able to see spark at the points if you manually open and close them, tells if the coil is working via the normal resistor circuit

and yes, do check out that pass thru connector on the distributor, they can cause problems

Bill

UPDATE:
I was sick in bed for most of yesterday, going out only to get the distributor cap in case I felt well enough to mess with things today.

Today I got a meter and test light and checked connections. All looked well except I noticed that somehow the point gap opened way up. I guess I didn't have it cranked down tight enough. I re-set the gap to .019" and prepared for another crank attempt.

This time, I could feel it was trying really hard to catch, but just not quite get there. Then, I noticed that I failed to pull out the choke. Once I got that pulled it, it sputtered to life very quickly! I know that I need to make external carb adjustments, but the crank that I got this evening was much better than before.

Seeing that it cranked, I then shut'er down, moved the plug wires to the new cap, and tried another start attempt (with the choke out this time!) It seemed to light off within seconds! I had the ignition checker light hooked up to the #2 plug and it seemed to pulse steadily. Later, I'll hook up my little engine analyzer and check the other diagnostics. (By the way, I was probably justified in being concerned about the center terminal inside the distributor cap. It should be crusty black, but mine was worn down pretty flat- the new one is cone-shaped. I don't think I had cap problems today, but I bet it wouldn't be long before I'd be dealing with that problem.)

I'll deal with the carb adjustments later when I feel more up to it. But I wanted to stop right now and express my thanks to you all, Bill, Stuart, 4ontheFloor, for your help, guidance, suggestions, and patience while I worked through this. I'm really confident that I got the problem solved. Although I changed out points, condenser, cap, and did a carb rebuild, I believe the problem was in the carburetor, probably at the accelerator pump. I don't think my later ignition issues were anything more than me screwing up something that was probably okay to begin with.

Thanks a million, guys.

Bill

A couple of things to keep in mind:

IMHO, the less starter fluid you use, the better. It has a tendency to scour the oil off the cylinder walls, which increases wear drastically. Once the engine starts, the oil film forms again, but starting an engine once probably puts more wear on it than driving it a hundred miles, because things aren't warmed up or lubricated correctly during cranking.

Second, be sure you lubricated the distributor cam with an appropriate lubricant. I did ignition tune-ups on a fleet of C-60 Chevys one night, and didn't have any lubricant. Didn't think anything about it. After about two days they started running badly and then just stopped. The pieces of phenolic that rubbed against the distributor cam to open the points were worn away to noting. Pretty embarrassing.

Final Update

I'm in tall cotton! Left the truck for a couple weeks, came back, gave it two pumps with the accelerator, pulled out the choke, vroom vroom! Analyzer says I have dwell at 30, rpms at 500. Vacuum gage is holding fairly steady at 20 measured under the carb.

Thanks to you all for the help in getting through this. If anyone else is reading, my recommendation would be to start with the carb rebuild, and then work from there.

Mucho appreciado.

Bill

I read this thread with much interest as my truck has the same problem. I have relied starter fluid for cold starts for a while now. So was it the carb rebuild that did it? The accelerator pump was the culprit? Not the battery, coil, or other suggestions? I'd like to know what tall cotton feels like!

Wilber

I did have exact same problems, but I changed my fuel pump and that did the magic. However honestly in the cold season, I believe the fuel made after 1972 will evaoprate and that is why Carburator bowl is empty, In summer you should have this problem. For now my truck starts rightup with new fuel pump in a 32 degress, it takes little more cranks and starts

Ganesh

I mean to say, In summer it should not happen

Ganesh

Wilber, I don't have any evidence of it, but I really think that the carb rebuild did the trick. The points/condenser were not in that bad of shape to begin with, but because of the ease and low dollar value, I went ahead and replaced them to eliminate the possibility.

I didn't change the battery and coil, so I think they can safely be eliminated as a possible cause. Otherwise, I'd still have the problem!

In the carb, I replaced parts (accelerator pump included) and adjusted the float to specification. I'm not sure if the replaced parts actually needed replacement, but I'm certain the float level needed adjustment. Whether replacement parts or float adjustment that fixed the problem is anyone's guess.

For my money, time, and effort, if I ever have this problem again, I'll concentrate on the carb first. Good luck on getting yours back to normal operation.

Bill

Bill, I REALLY like your conclusion (since we manufacture rebuilding kits)!

However, as a general rule (obviously, your case was an exception):

(1) compression test
(2) redo the ignition (or at least test it)
(3) THEN look at the carburetor.

Having read all of your comments, my guess would be your properly setting the carburetor float level was the action that solved the problem.

Glad you now have it fixed.

Jon.