The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Truck radiator boils over :(

We need updates, Otto.

Today I performed the pressure test on the cooling system. The cobbled up T for the heater hoses worked fine but plugging the radiator hoses was difficult. The stuff I bought to pligiug the upper hose didn't work/fit. The cap I bought for the lower hose was too big but the one for the upper fit in.

I luckily found a reducer with a threaded end lay+ing on a shelf in the plumbing dept of my mom's barn. Unbelievably I rummaged through a box of random sink and drain crap in another box and found a threaded cap that fit the reducer. It just fit the inside diameter of the upper hose.
I turned on the garden hose with 55psi and let it sit for over an hour.

It more or less held that pressure for over an hour. Spinning the starter multiple times did not squirt water out of the spark plug holes. I was able to look into the cylinders pretty well and saws no evidence of wetness.

So, no hard evidence of exhaust gases leaking into cooling system.

Oh ya, by the way, the loaner cooling system pressure test kit from Advance Auto which has "adapters to fit all the most common radiator caps and filler necks" did not have any that fit the 1941 Harrison radiator. Is this some sort of uncommon, oddball size? Well, it's identical to the one on the 1995 F-150, 1964 Galaxie 500, 1976 F-150, 1956 Cadillac, and probably almost every car made up to at least 2000 or so.

On the plus side, it was $311 deposit. I immediately received $35 in Speed Bucks coupons for Advance Auto. I'm sure I can find $35 worth of stuff I need.

Anyway, I pulled the radiator and water pump since I was out of other ideas.

Both look pretty good. Radiator has evidence of seepage. I'll have my guys give it the treatment.

I've never seen a water pump with such lamo impeller fins. Are they supposed to look like that or have they been worn down to nubs? Other than that it looks brand new and has no play in the bearing. Should I send it to the Flying Dutchman? Buy a new one?

I'mgoing to hazard a guess that a good radiator rebuild will solve most, if not all of your problems. If you know of a good water pump rebuilder, that would be the icing on the cake. "Buy once- - - -cry once!"
Jerry

Is that a normal looking 216 water pump impeller?

I am no 216 (or any other) water pump expert, but it looks to me like there is a lot of open space between the edge of the vanes of the pump and the bolt-on back plate of the pump. That could cause a lot of the coolant to just be running around in circles inside the pump instead of circulating through the engine & radiator.

Any comments from those more expert than I?

Just a pic for comparison purposes. https://www.ebay.com/itm/186212820364

I’d agree with Bill that Otto’s pump has pretty worn looking vanes. I don’t know enough to say that would cause a cooling problem but it surely couldn’t help?

Yes that's what I was thinking. They look pretty worn down but since I've never seen a 216 water pump before, I have no way of knowing what it's actually supposed to look like. That water pump probably came with the 1951 engine that somebody put in it in the 60s or the 70s

More pics for comparison, this from a 216 water pump rebuild kit: https://www.ebay.com/itm/374221850777?

The vanes on a new impeller look to have much more definition and are taller. Might make the difference in efficient coolant circulation,

Wow. That's a major difference. That rebuild kit looks a lot more like the impellers I'm used to seeing on other vehicles I've worked on. Nice large sharply defined veins

There is some difference. Those impellers should still flow water good at the top of the RAD when stat opens.
I guess a new rebuilt would have that rolling there.

I'm thinking the water pump is the prime suspect and the radiator is an accomplice.

I think I'll start a new thread from this point forward with any new information related to the radiator or pump.

If anybody has more pictures of a new water pump impeller, or can definitively tell me what's what with my impeller, please post the pics and let me know the straight dope.

Could the belt be slipping with coolant leaking down on it?

No. Belt was clean and there are no leaks anywhere other than the evidence of such on the front of the radiator. The white streak on the back of the radiator is from when I was flushing it last weekend.

Otto, Here's a picture of the water pump that came off my engine (last registered in the late 80's but still running.) It has a rebuild sticker on the pulley dated 1974. There's a little cavitation on the backer plate, but the impeller looks nearly new. The vanes stand a full 1/4 inch above the impeller plate. In comparison, I'd say your pump needs a rebuild.

Yep. Yours is well worn but it's in a lot better shape than mine. How did mine move any water?

Off to the Flying Dutchman.

You can buy a rebuild kit for these. Has anyone here rebuilt their own? Wondering how much of a PITA it might be?

I considered that but I don't have a press or pulley removal tool, etc. I'm planning to box it up and send it to Wade Janezen out in Oregon.

He has a good reputation in the antique car community for doing quality work on water pumps.

Water pump rebuilder and seller of antique water pumps for all makes and models. Services Europe and USA. New Cadillac pumps in stock for 1949 to 1962

Flying Dutchman

Wade Jenezon
650 Upper River Rd
Gold Hill, OR 97525 USA
1-888-595-1110 Outside the U.S., 1-541-450-2277
http://water-pump-rebuilders.com/

How much to rebuild?

Water pump rebuild $129 + shipping. (New one from Roack Auto is $110)

Radiator boil out/repair $125

Twere me, man I`d buy the one from rockauto and buy the rebuild kit
and wait for the opportunity to rebuild it myself . Might learn something.

If you can run a gear puller and an arbor press without mashing a few fingers in the process, it's a piece of cake! Usually, the repair kit has a bearing and seal assembly already put together so it's just a matter of getting it pressed together at the right depth.
Jerry

I considered that just to get the truck back on the road sooner but I probably should remind everybody here that Ol' Roy doesn't actually belong to me. I have it on permanent loan.

My friend who owns the truck knows absolutely nothing about cars. By that I mean he barely qualifies as a passenger let alone a driver. As far as mechanical ability of any kind, he's the classic example of someone who can't install a light bulb.

He moved to an apartment a couple years back and had no place to store the truck. I already had it at my house to get it running after it sat for 5+ years never being started.

I don't charge him for the work and he pays for the parts and insurance. I get to drive it as if its my own. He uses it when he needs to haul things to a storage unit or buy furniture, etc.

So, I try to spend his money as if it were my own (meaning as little of it as possible) but also err on the side of less work for me if it doesn't compromise quality. I have a million other projects going on. A Rip Van Winkle, 1972 240Z showed up at my house last week. Same deal. I get it roadworthy and get to drive it While my friend pays for the parts.

I stumbled onto this yesterday. Two part video of the Flying Dutchman’s rebuild of a “Chevy 6” water pump. I think it’s probably the 216 style relevant to this thread. Worth a watch. He actually does machine work on the internals to true up the sealing surfaces. Claims that the rebuild kits tend to leak if you don’t get the runout below a couple thousandths.

I have no direct experience to confirm that he’s correct, nor to refute him. My initial impression is that his rebuild cost is pretty darn cheap for the level of work he’s doing here. Best I can tell, a rebuild kit to do it myself is roughly $75.

The Flying Dutchman Shows You How To Rebuild a Water Pump! Part 1

(That’s just the part 1 video. Your browser should help you find part 2)

Jw, I've been aware of the flying Dutchman or over 25 years. His work is pretty well known at least in the Cadillac community for a long time and his quality has always been reported to be extremely high. I have never personally needed a water pump rebuild so this will be my first experience.

About 15 years ago I compiled a list of antique Cadillac parts and service suppliers for the Cadillac Club, the Frying Dutchman being one of them. Of course many of them cross over to other makes and models. It's a list of about 200 plus vendors, including salvage yards, repair shops, parts suppliers, NOS suppliers, and even custom parts suppliers.

The work in the video is definitely a lot more than I would have been able to do myself. $129 seems like a bargain.

Shipping the silly thing both ways is what makes it something more than a complete no-brainer.

When a new pump (albeit from questionable origins) is only $100ish…that’s what would make me weigh both options.

Before I watched his video, I probably leaned toward buying the kit and rebuilding myself. The thought of doing that and still having a leaky pump….seems less than attractive.

Be sure and watch part 2. He describes an important clearance issue between the impeller and the housing on the Stovebolt pump where if it's to great, it won't move water at idle and will only be fair at driving speed. He said he sees a lot of pumps with too much space between the vanes and housing.

He even machines the fan hub so the fan sits flat and turns without wobbling.