The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Wheels, now replacement wheel issue (split rims)

Anyone purchased the wheels now wheels for the split rim replacement? I bought six of them and thy are awesome.... EXCEPT, they are to thick when the duals are on the back. The studs are now about a 1/2" to short. I've exhausted every effort to locate 3.5" long , 11/16" -16TPI wheel studs. All i can find is 3.25" like what we have on our trucks( like what the link takes you to below.) I've even reached out to some custom bolt manufactures and they all told me they wont do a run for only 30 studs.


https://www.bigrigchromeshop.com/25...ith-761-inch-knurl-diameter-p-36492.html

So we can all be on the same page, are your original wheels Budd (stud piloted) or Motor Wheels (hub piloted)?

What size studs does the manufacturer of your new wheels recommend (what size are the stud holes) and are they stud or hub piloted wheels?

Mike B

How about Dorman Wheel Studs 610-0161.10 , they are 3 5/8". Did you mean to say 16 tpi?

Looks like he's got the same two ton Chevy 10 bolt wheels that I also just bought new. I was afraid the studs might be too short, but on the front wheel they are flush with the insides of the nuts just as the old ones were. Haven't tried the rear wheels yet.

Out of curiosity @AKrause, though I'm afraid to ask at $22 per stud, [EDIT] Oops I misread the listing, it's $22 for a pack of ten which seems much more reasonable! how much would it be to go in on a run of 30 of these studs, well it would be at least 40 since we'd each need twenty studs. Also, since this is going to be an increasingly common issue as more of us update our two tons to modern day, not-a-time-bomb-RH5 wheels, I wonder how many others might be interested?

I understand that further discussion of this might well be for a different forum, as a mod will kindly instruct us :-) since there's the mention of money being passed around.

As an aside, a set of these studs that are an inch longer than stock would also open up the possibility of alloy wheels, which are thicker in the center than steel.

If it may be helpful, below is a screenshot of the specs list for the Dorman Wheel Studs Super55 posted. Looks like a perfect match to the dimensions of the "bigrig..." 3.25' long wheel studs, except just that extra 3/8" length. Not sure if that is enough meat for your wheel mounting, but you have the measurements to go check it out with. Let us know what you figure out please and thanks!

My original wheels are 3/8" thick in the center where they bolt on and that's 6/16 or 12/32". The new wheels measure 15/32" in the center, so that's 3/32" different. A pair of them would be 3/16" or 6/32" thicker. So a 3/8" longer stud would do the trick nicely. As an aside.. it sure is a good thing we can't just use millimeters like the rest of the world :-D

And now I know I need to order 20 of these studs for my rig too, since I'm gonna have the rear hubs off to check the brakes and replace the wheel cylinders anyway. I wonder if the old studs would fit the front hubs, and wind up sticking out farther than the stock ones owing to not going through a hub flange as well as a drum.

Another Big Bolt problem solved, thanks guys!

Tronman, since AK hasn't responded to my post yet are your wheels stud (Budd) or hub (Motor) piloted ?

Do you have right and left hand threaded studs?

Mike B

Mine are hub pilot motor wheels, as in not Budd style. Also mine is all right handed threads, and unless you need to keep it pure for the parade resto, you can put RH thread studs on the left side of the rig, since that's what they started doing to the same hub and wheel combo from the factory, anyway.

His truck has wheels like mine, according to the picture.

If there are going to be more of these wheels, perhaps Wheels Now would be the one to have a bunch of studs made and sell with each set of wheels. I would think they would h@ve figured this out when going to thicker hub center materials!

Ed

My wheels are hub and wheel combo. The guys at wheels now will not really help you out with this... I tried. there are even people on theri facebook group with them advertising these wheels complaining about it! The part number 610-0161.10 is correct. I have them coming in tomorrow for the rears. They should work perfectly! they were really hard to find for some reason though and most parts stores dont even offer them anymore. Summit says they have two 10 packs in stock. Tronman order them up quick cause i had a hard time finding them elsewhere. Amazon had mine and i bought the last two this morning. thanks everyone for your help!!

Also tronman- if you get the new lugs studs get new nuts. below is a link. Hopefully they are better quality than the stockers mine have now. The machining is about as good as nuts were from 1965. Im hopeful the new dorman ones are much nicer. You never want to put new studs with old nuts.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001C0FARA

Thanks, I'll order them up. Although I don't see why I need to replace the nuts, mine are perfectly good. I can think of other times where I replaced some of the studs (as when stripped or broken) the nuts to match, then the remaining old studs and nuts were left alone and it didn't matter if they mixed later on. Then again, I've always used anti-seize on the lugs of every vehicle I own-despite the dire warnings about new GM cars and not doing so-and I've yet to find a nut working its way loose again later on.

One of my mechanic jobs was in a tire shop, and about fifty galled, ruined lug nuts and free stud replacements in, I decided that anti-seize was a good idea.

Tronman- just a thought up to you if you dont want to replace them! The new nuts I can confirm are much nicer than the ones I had on my 65' as far as machining goes. They look to much better quality. Issue now is look at the longer studs. The knurled portion is much higher up on the shaft...UGH! hopefully they will fit well without issue and the knurling will not keep the wheel from going flat on the hub face. Not to mention i hope its enough to grab onto the hub and not spin off later. Guess ill get these on and see how it goes when i get my brakes back from being re-frictioned. (EDIT) also i just checked and anything after the threads will not fit in the wheel mounting hole.....Thought this might be easy!NOPE


Also i confirmed with Dorman the Wheel Studs P# - 610-0161.10 picture is incorrect everywhere on the internet. The one I have pictured is the correct for that P# but will not fit our trucks without major mods. I've got a line with a custom bolt manufacture that actually is willing to help in small QTY's. God knows what the price will be for 20-40 of them..... Also asked dorman if they would make some longer ones they simply told me no.

Well, one company came back at $2000 for 40-60 studs. Actually talking to my local machinist and seeing if we can machine down the longer ones to the correct specs. We shall see.

It looks like the longer stud splines are not in the correct place, the short one has the splines much closer to the head.

I needed cab molding clips back in 2005 for my '57 Fire Engine and what ALL the vendors were selling at that time were incorrect and would damage the molding if used. I contacted a clip factory and asked how much it would be to make the 46 clips I needed (I sent him a few original clips I had as samples). The cost came back at $750.00 which was one hour of machine time plus materials. I then asked how many clips could be made in that one hour and what the added material cost would be. To let the machine run for one hour he could make 4000 clips for an additional $200 in materials, so for $950.00 I had 4000 clips made, sold the extras and got my clips for free, sort of!

Mike B

Interestingly, the longer studs pictured might work for my bus, and here's why.. the 1965 original axle had a pullover rear drum, you could just remove it to service the brakes without getting into the hub if it wasn't leaking. I like that feature, but lost it when I updated to the newer T70 axle. Those hubs aren't pullover, the drum is behind the hub and you've got to remove the hub to even service the brakes. So what the new stud looks like to me, is it's made for the stud retained drum and that's why the knurled portion is out farther. The new bolt has a shoulder between the knurl and the head, which would locate the drum along with the hub pilot. The knurl would then go into the hub and hold everything tight.

Tronman- you described that very well actually! Like you painted a picture with your words LOL! That would make since why the knurls are so far up. I highly doubt a medium duty truck hub face would ever be that thick. But if the lug holds the drum on it makes perfect sense!

Another option would be to have when built or by yourself, drill the bolt holes in the wheels oversized by .125” or so; not just with a drill bit but undersize drill bit and final size reamer. Then, depending how much too short the studs are, turn down a portion of the nuts, half the distance the studs are too short, to whatever the oversize wheel bolt holes are, so a portion of the nuts will enter the wheels giving full thread engagement, but giving room for both wheels to fit on too short studs.

Dimensions given are just guideline, they should be determined to fit your application!

Ed

Thank you! I tried to make it make sense. What's likely happening here is that Jansa uses blank 22.5" wheel centers meant for heavier trucks, so they are closer to 1/2" thickness than the ones made back then for our medium duty rigs; then they just machine the pilot and drill the holes to fit our bolt pattern. Works fine, we get a stronger wheel, but the downside is the studs come up short.

I’ve got one company that told me they would have no problem matching the exact same old stud but the section below the threads would just be a 1/4” longer. Local too! I’ll know the price tomorrow, getting a price for qty 20,40 and 60. We shall see! They are a custom bolt manufacturer.

Shoot, this just occurred to me today.. what if the Dorman part is longer because it needs to be longer in order to stick out the same distance from my T170 hub and drum combination? I don't have it apart so I can't measure things up. At least it does look like the shoulder starts at the same place and the threads are just longer. Might not know for sure til I take it apart, or until someone else with a T170 axle buys a set of these wheels and does the stud update.

Tronman- I got a price for qty 20. It’s $30 a stud. If anyone else is interested we can get it down to $20 a stud. I’m more than willing to place the order for them if anyone else is interested. I would not mark them up only ask that you cover shipping costs and pay for the price I payed per stud. Let me know! I’m thinking I’ll give these guys the go ahead by Friday. Thanks everyone!

Welp, it only took 2.5 months. Long story but the studs FINALLY came in and are perfect. Already have the hubs and drums back on and torqued. Just waiting for RTV to dry to put the wheels back on. Took alot of beating on the back of them with a 5lb hammer to get them back seated but they look great and will work fantastic!

Wow, those do look great!! If I have to do this on mine, at least now I know that it's possible. Nice work!

Just out of curiosity, did anyone take you up on the offer to have some made for their rigs, too?

nope no one did take me up. they are nice but man what a bear to get the wheels back on. Since they were so new and didn't have 60+ years on wheels on and off it was a workout. Of course everything on our big bolts is!

That it is. I noticed that the new wheels are heavier than the originals. New 22.5s weigh 91lbs, whereas the Accuride USA made 22.5s weigh 71lbs. I tried for years to find a set of Accurides, to no avail. So the heavy duty Turkish Jantsas it is.

let me tell you when you go to mount those new wheels/tire combo its a Son of a gun.... Im 35 in good shape and it took me a couple breaks to get r done.

Indeed! Get the rig about an inch higher up than it needs to be for the wheel to clear the studs, then maneuver it up and on with a big pry bar.