The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area General Truck Talk Data plate and title numbers

My 1950 3100 has a this on the data plate, 5 HP-F 17255. What can you tell from this? The title reads HBA624380. Is this the original engine number. I have a replaced rebuilt 216 in it now, the pad is clean with no serial numbers. I have owned this truck since 1982 and removed the old engine due to a cracked water jacket about 1984. It wasn't bad and previous owner did JB weld repair, but it started leaking a little and decided to replace it. The old engine is lying in the junk pile on the ground out at the ranch for probably for 40 years. If I could read the pad, maybe the numbers are on it as the title reads? Is it legal to stamp the clean pad with the title numbers? Does not matter to me, but if my heirs sell it, would there be problems as it is now. I am going to register my 1950 Texas Truck tags tomorrow, the tag is clear. get a 5 year sticker and no inspections. last registered in 1992, so it might not be in the system any more.

As far as the legality of restamping that engine, you need to speak with your local DMV. They are the only ones that can advise you on that.

5 = Kansas City, MO plant
H = 1950 year code
P = 3100 Model
F = June build month
17255 = 16,255th truck off the assembly line.

HBA624380 = Flint plant engine, 216 3100 series, number 623,380th engine produced at that plant.
Replaced engines had no serial number.

Stamping your own number to match the title is very likely NOT legal. You should investigate whether you can find the engine serial number and fess up to DMV about the engine being changed. They MAY let you re-title it with the number on the data plate. Some states used engine serial numbers for titles. Don't know about Texas.

The replacement engine should have been restamped OR a corrected title issued like I did on my 52
I know what I'd do under the circumstances....and no, its not illegal but different states do it different ways.

(Load the old motor and take it with you...or at least offer for them to see it.)

Back in the late '60s when I was restoring a Model A that was registered in California by engine number, they had a form for engine change that required that you notify them within 10 days of changing the engine. The registration was by engine serial number, (although the number was stamped in other places on the truck.) This was before VIN's were widely used on new vehicles. Since the truck wasn't on the road, I figured that they'd waive the 10 day requirement, but I got a stickler at DMV. They wanted to fine me for not reporting the change within that time. I left and went back with a "corrected" form, and got the truck registered. They also required a "certificate of non-operation" with info like your neighbor's name and address and a local gas station. Like they were going to check.

Hopefully Texas isn't as bad as California was back then.

Thanks to all for the info. I am going to look at the old engine and see if it is readable. Good to know when and where my truck was built.

As long as you have a clean title and registration there should not be any problems if your heirs sell it later. I would just take a digital image of the old engine, prepare a written statement outlining the history and put it with your important papers. But you might not even need that. The folks at the dmv here understand a truck that is over 70 years old is very likely to have a different engine by now. If you had only owned it for a few months that might raise some eyebrows, but since you've owned it for 40+ years...that's kind of a different game. Good luck.

We don't register tags where I live, we register the vehicle. Anyway I don't know what the issue would be in TX about heirs. In my state they would take the title and the will to DMV, get title in their name and then sell it. As far as a buyer goes, they would be comfortable if the title serial number matched something on the truck. Now is the time to get that done.
It won't be the first time TX DMV is told that back then they used the motor number and motors get replaced. The procedure lies with them. Your actual questions have been answered. I'm sure you will get it worked out with DMV, but as said, don't do ANY self numbering. Present the situation as is.

Some of us have no idea what this means " I am going to register my 1950 Texas Truck tags tomorrow, the tag is clear. get a 5 year sticker and no inspections. last registered in 1992, so it might not be in the system any more."

The word "tags" in some states means license plates. In my state it means a sticker in the corner of the plate to show expiration date of registration. When well sell, we keep the plates, sign over the title and the buyer gets new plates with a new plate number.....and a new title. VIN stays the same of course.

Sounds to me like he is talking about taking a set of '50 Texas tags to the courthouse and getting those YOM plates into use as historical/antique plates for his truck. The state will make sure that license number is not already in use and will issue a little tag to be placed on or near the YOM rear tag.

Legally, the vehicle with this type of plate is very limited to driving in parades, special events, etc. I've driven mine over 40K miles and the Gestapo hasn't stopped me yet.

I was in the county tax office this morning with my year of manufacture license plates, 1950. The plate number was not in use and the plate passed a visual look, color scheme correct and in good shape. The plate has to have TRUCK at the bottom and these are hard to come by and also have a pair for front and rear. I was issued a small sticker and metal tag to place on the upper corner of the plate, probably similar to the metal tag on war year license plates. This was new to me as my other 3 cars with YOM plates have a windshield sticker with month and year dates. The small sticker I got to put on the metal tag is the same we would put on a trailer. There is no place to put the sticker on the 1950 plate because they are a different size from modern plates and would partially cover some lettering. Old plates came in different sizes depending on the year, older ones were narrow width compared to length, then close dimensionally to modern plates, but still not the same. I don't know what year they were standardized, but all states have the same size plates now.
Texas used to issue the small sticker to go on your license plate and the inspection sticker went on the lower driver's side windshield. That stopped several years ago. Now you get a vehicle inspection and then go to the county tax office to get a windshield sticker with month and year, good for 1 year. This is your renewal for your vehicle's license plate. There are no longer any inspection stickers to place on the windshield. Vehicle inspection did go down in cost from $15 to $7 dollars. YOM plates are considered antique or classic car plates and good for 5 years and no vehicle inspection is needed. My small sticker is dated 03/28. If you register a YOM plate in 2024, it will still read 03/28 but the cost will be prorated one year less. My cost was $65.75. I paid $400 for these plates 4 years ago, they are now up to $600. And you best call before purchase and make sure that plate number is not in use or you could be SOL if they are.
Next year Texas is to do away with vehicle inspection. I don't know about the emissions test, my county is not required to have emission testing. Sounds confusing. We don't pay a yearly vehicle tax like some states. Home owners carry that burden. My home taxes are $6700 but are frozen as I am over 65 years old. Appraisal went up by 51K this year but I pay the same amount, thank God.

SHOF , I really do not think this would be a legal issue per se but a “fraud “ issue . Although my experience with re stamping engines is with older SBC’s . When would do a serious deck job it often eliminate the numbers and would ALWAYS put the old number back on .it would NEVER leave the shop blank . We had a situation where we decked a 265 and left it blank next thing we heard guyre-stamped it with corvette F &G codes and asking big bucks .
Ps. We put the word out on him

I have several old vettes and know the restamping issues of big blocks. 67 coupe is original 327/300, 69 t-top has a 350 crate engine. Not much of a fraud issue in a lowly 216 engine.

There are the same kinds of issues in the collectible firearms community. Certain German Mauser 98 rifles from the years between WWI and WW II bring big bucks, if they have the correct "Waffenampts" (inspectors' cartouche stampings). There's a big business in reproducing the stamping dies used to create those markings, which can turn a virtually worthless "Russian Captured" Mauser into a high dollar collectible. "Buyer Beware!"
Jerry

Just a reminder to stay on topic and remember that the local DMV is the authority on what is and is not legal for restamping the ID numbers, especially in this case where those numbers are on the title.

Any other advice here is opinion only and should be treated as such.

Good advice. And from reading various other comments in other posts, it seems a very good idea to check first and also keep good records and notes on what's going on.

"Buyer be ware" and "Owners be smart."

Shod:
I bought my 1948 3100 in 1978 in southern Illinois. It had a legitimate Illinois title listing it as a 1948 truck.
“3EP-H13136” which if you decode it is a St. Louis truck but a 1947 model. (Thank goodness it wasn’t titled with an engine number). At some point I inspected the medal vin tag at the driver’s door and surprise:
“3FP-H13136”᠁..1948! Apparently somehow, before I bought it, the VIN got screwed up with the Illinois DMV/title. Fast forward 10-20 years later and I’m living in Missouri and painfully, slowly am resto-modding the truck and I figure I better eventually get a Missouri title for it. Missouri had a process whereby you could submit a form to have your vehicle inspected by the County PD for a title/VIN/mileage issue. A County PD Motorcycle Cop came to my address, and confirmed the error on the Illinois title vs the VIN tag. Before he completes his paperwork (Peggy, you’ll love this᠁.) he asks me what the odometer mileage is. I’m an honest guy so I show him the speedo gage on my workbench that I’d just rebuilt and that I’d reset the odometer to “00000.00”. He says “No problem, Sir. Nice job, have a nice day.” I then took my copy of his paperwork to the DMV and a few weeks later my Missouri title shows up with the correct VIN/MY info and 00000.00 for the odometer info. Fast forward to 2016 and now I’m retired in Texas, and finally driving Old Blu. One of the first things I did as a Tx resident was to get all of my vehicles titled in Texas. Shod, my question to you is, can’t you somehow get your title changed to reflect the VIN tag on the driver’s door? Have you done any research? And Shod, I’ve included a pic of where I put the metal registration tag on my 1948 plates.
Good luck, Dave

Dave
It looks good in the lower right corner. I never thought to put it there. The sticker is just like a trailer sticker and they go on the upper right. I placed mine on the upper left instead of upper right because it is closer to the lower tailgate hinge and harder to see.
The clerk gave me a metal tab to put the sticker on and then bolt that to the license plate. The metal tab is about twice the size of the sticker and covered part of year and last plate digit.
I have not investigated a change yet, i did notice my registration as does my title has my old address on it, I told the clerk my new address and she said she new from the insurance paper I gave her. I didn't see the mistake till I got home.

Shof, I cut down that little plate they gave me and trimmed the sticker to fit. Have had it at the lower right corner of the license plate for the last 6 years. Made sense to me.
Good luck.

Exactly my point SHOF ᠁ ? That lowly 216 with “low miles”

A little side note. When I was stationed in Huntsville Al in 1969, I would see cars of all makes going to Al. without license plates because they did not require a title to sell. I traded in my 1963 Falcon convertible and the title was back home I said I would have it sent, but they said don't bother you can write one a grocery sack down there.