The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Best engine choice for swapping out a 1953 216 IL 6cyl

Looking for some advice on swapping out a 216 IL 6 to an upgraded engine. I have an original engine 216 in a 1953 Chevy 3100 and I need to either rebuild this motor or replace it with something a little more modern but still looking era correct. Spoke with some machine shops near me and most want no part in doing the work on this motor. The one place I found estimated my cost at $7800 to $8500 for a rebuild. I read various threads about using a Chevy S 10 drive train and thought this might be my route to take. Is there a particular year I should look for in the S 10? Kind of all over the place with my question as I am looking for my best options to keep this truck and be able to drive it on more than just an occasional Sunday.

Deegs53

Chevrolet 261 6-cylinder engine

and

3.55 Ring and pinion rear-end gears.

gasket set

installation kit

There might be a Tech Tip about this item here on Stovebolt.com (maybe written by Chris Sweet?)?
Maybe someone will post a link to it?

I second the 261 option. That truck is too nice to start taking apart to drop on an S10 frame. The 261 looks original to the untrained eye, full pressure oiling, more grunt; it’s a great option and many on this site can walk you through. Get some good ratio gears and you’ll love driving the truck. I know I do on my ‘51 GMC 1 ton. $8000 for a rebuild?! Good grief! That’s the “I don’t want to do it” price. I think I put about $2500 into my ‘62 261 rebuild. New pistons, rings, gaskets, bearings, paint, carb rebuild, valves, block boring, cleaning, alternator. That was few years ago now, but it was no where near $8000.

People like it when you pop the hood and it still has a straight six. “Oh! You have the original engine in it!”

“Riiiiight….Original.” 😉

That truck's beautiful. Leave it alone.

Currently, I'm in the process of building a 258 cubic inch inline six on a 216 block that will look exactly like the original engine in your truck. Even the casting numbers will shout "I'm a 216"! That project isn't easy, not inexpensive, and there are very few machinists who would attempt the project, even with an unlimited budget. My first one is headed for a demonstration trailer with a dyno attached, and it should get some attention at car shows.

If you can find a 261 engine to build, that will be the simplest, and probably least expensive way to stay original-appearing to most of the people you'll encounter at a "show and shine", especially if you use the 2-bolt valve cover off the 216.
Jerry

Word of caution, before you remove the original engine check your title, it may be using the engine serial number to ID your truck. If it is using the engine serial you'll need to contact your local DMV for instructions on how to replace the bad engine and retain a valid title.

Mike B

Please describe the reasons why your 216 engine needs rebuilding.
Your truck appearance is first rate but curiosity leads to question the condition of your drivetrain.
What are your driving plans? Do you want an expressway cruiser, backroad runner or a show truck?

Hardcore truck owners would redo the 216. Same people frown on having furniture wood in the bed.
Some of us who want more "get-up-and-go" will do the 235 or better 261 (if one can be found).
The S10 route is radical. Like doing a V8. This is where you would post in the "HiPo Shop" section of Stovebolt.

We don't bite too badly but some of us have been known to do harsh rhetoric (sometimes more like old man ramble).
Discussion is cheap so use it to your advantage.


Lackland in 72.

Is that a HEI ignition/Distributor?

Edit: oh, that’s not on the orig posters truck".

The price quote you've received on rebuilding the 216 is approximately twice what the cost should be. The 216 is difficult to rebuild, but by no means impossible or that expensive. Most shops want to do lots of modifications because they don't know how to do an original type rebuild. There's still a few of us old geezers around who remember how to do the job the right way, the first time! I'm working with a young man in Oklahoma to help him rebuild an original 1953 235 engine in a 2 ton truck his grandfather bought in 1955, and it's still working for a living hauling grain. I'm also advising a man in Virginia who is rebuilding his first Babbit-rod stovebolt engine and putting it back in original condition. I'd suggest that you shop around a little more for an engine builder who won't rob you like Jesse James!
Jerry

The 261 would my #1 choice..they are getting harder to find one at reasonable prices. #2 choice Full pressure 235. Both look period correct and most external engine parts fit from your 216 on to them!
Beautiful looking truck. Once you butcher it , it will never be an original. Just my opinion. IE: S-10 chassis...

That estimate is not only too high, but includes work you may not need, replacing parts that are safe to re-use, and anticipating some of your core is junk.
Shop around.

I agree, 261 is the best choice.

Thank you all for your suggestions and response to my question.
Some background info. I looked for a truck that was original or extremely close for a while before finding this truck. I purchased the truck how it looks now. I have only done minor maintenance items on it over the past year.
I noted the truck was smoking a bit after driving it 4or 5 times. Now it is bug spraying and choking anyone unfortunate to get stuck behind me. Thought about a rebuild or upgrading the engine to something era correct to get away from the 216.
Checked around at various machine shops for the work to rebuild and most just flat out refused to work on it but one suggested a machine shop that specializes in antique engine restoration, that is where the that cost came from. At that price I figured I would be better off finding something more modern that I can rebuild and machine shops will work on it. Don't really want to swap out the frame I just read someone's post who utilized an engine from an S10.

Don’t discount a 235 as they are plentiful and very suitable replacement. My ‘52 has a ‘59 235 and it has 135 HP, about a 33% increase than the original 216. You would want to find a newer 235 as the older pre 54 truck engines still had babbited rod journals, and would leave you in the same boat that you are in today.

A perfect replacement engine would be a truck 54-55 235 as they would be a bolt in replacement. The water pump will be in the correct higher position.

Next in line would be 56-62 235 from either a truck or a car. This would require you to purchase and install a water pump relocation plate, available from a fellow bolter Pre’68 Dave, to raise the pump into the proper position for cooling. I did this with my ‘59 and it was not hard at all.

All manual transmission trucks have engines with solid lifters. All trucks with automatic transmissions and cars, have hydraulic lifters.

You can also install the 216 valve cover to disguise it from most spectators but the experts.

I think you can rebuild the engine you have. MAchine shops will do the individual parts I'm sure, just won't put them together for you.

You already know the engine works. It just needs freshening up.

I've been putting over 100 miles a week on my 216 that, evidence suggests, has never been rebuilt. It's a good running engine and cruises confidently at 55mph.

I'm not winning any races during rush hour but I get where I'm going without any stress.

Unless the piston rings are totally worn out, there's a quick, simple, and inexpensive way to reduce smoking to an acceptable level, if not eliminate it altogether. Instead of doing a major overhaul, Do an oil change with fresh 30 weight oil (straight weight, not something like 10W-30) and add 2 or 3 quarts of Diesel fuel to overfill the crankcase. This will allow the crankshaft and connecting rods to splash down into the oil/Diesel mix, and churn it around like the agitator in a washing machine. Run the engine for about 30 minutes at a fast idle- - - -1500 RPM or so. DO NOT DRIVE THE VEHICLE OR PUT ANY LOAD ON THE ENGINE! Afterwards, drain the oil while it's hot, change the oil filter if there's one onboard, and refill with fresh 15W-40 oil.

If your smoking problem is caused by sticky piston rings, the flush will dislodge the crud behind the rings and allow them to re-seat themselves against the cylinder walls. If the flush doesn't help, you will have done a much better internal cleaning prior to a rebuild than any amount of brush and solvent work can accomplish. Win/Win! Several stovebolters have done this procedure and have been very pleased with the results. If it doesn't work, the total cost is nothing more than an oil change and a little bit of Diesel fuel. Good luck!
Jerry

Edit: Check your private messages- - - -the flashing envelope icon at the top right of the page.

Just found these on Jim Carters website. Both re-babatted and insert style and it doesn’t say “Out of Stock”. No guarantees their not though!

I hope $630 is the price for an entire set of six!

Everyone on here is providing excellent advice. I'll just add an endorsement of the 235 (or 261 if you can find it) route. When I was young and stupid, a mechanic friend talked me into dropping a 350 into my '53 truck. Worst mistake of my life! They don't fit right, you need to fab or install motor mounts, move the steering box, cut the firewall, etc. etc. Major PITA. If I had known then what I know now, I would have gone straight to a 54-up 235 (or 261). They bolt right in and provide a nice uptick in power. With a rear end gear change (and/or bigger tires), you can get acceptable highway speed. 235s are plentiful and not terribly costly to rebuild. I have 3 235 blocks and 1 261 sitting in my shop now--my inventory for future projects. All were acquired locally via Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace for $100 to $300 each. In my 46 Chevy car I have a fully rebuilt 235 (bored out .60, which, if my calculations are correct makes it a 248); I spent about $1800 getting it rebuilt at a local shop--that was about 3 years ago, I know prices are up some but still not crazy for essentially a new motor. In my 53 truck I have a '48 big truck 235 that I picked up for $250 and just dropped in because it only had 5,000 miles on it! Best purchase I've ever made--my truck starts easily, has plenty of power, and will do 70mph with my 4.10 rear and big tires.

Conclusion: stay with a stovebolt 6! They are great motors, they are what these trucks were designed for, they are still plentiful, and they are relatively easy and inexpensive to work with.

Best of luck--let us know what you decide.

I've got over a hundred Babbit connecting rods stockpiled, new, used, and reconditioned. I don't use the Jesse James approach to rob fellow stovebolters, as my main reason for accumulating them is to bore the big ends for insert bearings, and if anyone who wants to do an original style rebuild, your worn rods could be swapped for "as new" replacements. People who charge outrageous prices for scarce parts should be worked over with a belt sander and made to swim laps in a vat of alcohol!
Jerry

Thanks for all the ideas. I plan to try what Jerry suggested to see if that works and stops or significantly lowers the amount of smoke I am getting now.
I am not looking to make this truck a Rat Rod.. My goal is to keep it original or as close as possible and have a truck I can drive around without choking people.

This truck is my retirement toy and I searched for about 18 months before finding one this original and in my price range. I plan to retire in May 23 and have been making plans for my projects that will enhance the safety and ride yet keep the truck looking original without cutting or altering the original truck. Then Fred (my grandchildren named the truck) decided to take up smoking at 69 years old so that lead me down this path. Again than you for your words of encouragement and suggestions I will post my actions and progress.

Tom

If you're retired, you have plenty of time to do a rebuild of the original engine yourself if necessary.

Yes, that is for six. Pricey but much cheaper route than the 8k price tag the shop wanted.

If during your troubleshooting, you find that the rods are an issue, I would contact Jerry and see if he can help you out.

Otto,
I don't know where you are in regards to retirement, but being retired doesn't mean you have time on your hands.

Deegs, I have a spare rebuilt 216 sitting around in my garage. I did everything except the rod bearings. If you want a project to upgrade PM me.

Retirement is many years away for me.

Have you checked the road draft tube to see if maybe it's clogged up? Suddenly developing a smoking problem doesn't necessarily mean the rings are bad- - - -there might be a buildup of crankcase pressure due to inefficient venting. A bad dual action fuel pump with a torn vacuum boost diaphragm will also create a smoke generator. I just checked my stash. I've got a big supply of reconditioned rods, and the oldtimers I learned the trade from actually had the ability to swap 216 rods from the bottom side without removing the cylinder head- - - - -they just pulled the piston down low enough in the cylinder after removing the pan to slip the wrist pins out of the pistons and install a reconditioned rod. That won't work on a 235 spray-oiler. The bore is too big to let the piston drop down far enough to expose the wrist pin.
Jerry

Edit: Ebay is full of 216/235 Babbit rods at fairly reasonable prices, but the later 235 insert bearing rods are scarce and expensive for some reason. I'm shopping for a set of six 54/62 rods to recondition. If anyone following this thread has some, please drop me a PM.

Jerry
No I have not checked the draft tube but now that you mention it I don"t recall seeing any oil drops on the absorb ant pad I keep under the tube.
Thanks that gives me another item to check.

Tom

There's a low tech- - - -primitive- - - -messy, but very effective way to clean the gunk out of a draft tube. Remove it from the block by disconnecting the clamp and wobble it side to side until it slips out of the hole in the block. Pour several ounces of gasoline, kerosene, or charcoal lighter fluid into the canister, put it on a pile of gravel or maybe a charcoal grill, and light it up. It will burn for half an hour or more and create big clouds of smoke. The crud inside the canister and the tube will turn to ash, which can be removed by tapping the cooled-down canister and tube with a hammer. Better warn the neighbors, and maybe the local fire department first, because it will look like your house or shop is on fire!
Jerry

LOL. Not sure I can get away doing that here. I work at the old Philadelphia Navy Yard and I have some friends at the engine mock up. They have some vats of cleaning solvent s Andi will get them to put the tube in for a couple of days. I think that will clean it out.

Tom

Living on 100 acres on a dead end gravel road 20 miles from the nearest town has its advantages. There's only a couple of neighbors close enough to even see a plume of smoke, and they have gotten used to my shenanigans over the past 30-something years. That also includes sighting in the custom deer rifles I build on my own 300-yard shooting range. I can't outdo the neighbor who adjoins me- - - -he's got a 600 yard range and a water cooled Browning .30 caliber machine gun!
Jerry

You guys are my kind of neighbors.

Jerry, you are lucky, I enjoyed your place!

Ed

Just one more data point on the 261 that often gets overlooked .... The early 261's (the ones built for the 1954 and 1955.1 Advance Design big trucks) also have the high water pump mounting. More info can be found in the 261 Rebuilding Tech Tip.

But the thing to remember is that there were 261s made during those model years to fit those trucks, as well as 261s made *after* those years (as crate /replacement engines), too. I have one

So when you find a 261, be sure to check the casting numbers carefully. As you will read in the tech tip, it makes a *real* difference -- not just because of the water pump ... You might get lucky like me and find a 261 that requires *zero* mods to install in your AD truck. Um ... but if you want to stay 6 volts, you'll have to ... read the tech tip ...

Ed .... I want to be Jerry when I grow up.

The following information/link might have been mentioned above. If so, I apologize for the redundancy.

water-pump relocation plate that is needed when putting a 1955-2nd or later 235/261 engine on an earlier truck.