The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Paint and Body Shop How to repair Pitting in front window frame

I have some widow frame rot on both lower corners and am considering buying a stretcher/ shrinker and bender and trying it myself or paying someone to do it. Cost for tools is probably 250, experience 0 vs Cost to have a fabricator do it??? Figure could sell the tools when done to recoup some money.
Thoughts?

Thanks,
Eric

That really doesn't look that bad. If it was me, I'd consider filling with an epoxy filler. Unless there's a lot of rust underneath, I don't think you've lost much structural strength.

Maybe weld some small patches in the worst spot that could be formed with hand tools. You can buy windshield pillars, but that's taking a it a bit too far IMO.

Others may have different opinions.

Stop any further rust (blast/epoxy/etc.) The windshield rubber will cover that area. So seal the holes and leave be. Or go full replacement if it sets your mind at ease.

Try this ,that's not bad looking at all . Have fixed a lot worse.

https://www.permatex.com/products/adhesives-sealants/epoxies/permatex-steel-weld-epoxy/

Not bad at all. I'd take it to metal, get a couple of packs of J-B Weld, mix a bit at a time, fill carefully using a small plastic spreader and let harden. The regular J-B Weld (not the Kwik Weld) gives you longer working time. Be certain to draw the epoxy up the side of the pinch weld, too. Making this nice and smooth will help a lot when you install your windshield. Then sand smooth. Paint this well when you paint the cab of course.

If that is the worst, it's not serious. I agree with the sentiment here. The pinch weld is two pieces of metal. I see the outer piece has pitting/holes, if the inner is ok, it will act as a backer for some MIG fill and grind smooth. As said, the area will be covered. Weld is the best way to fix rust if you are experienced, if not, the other ways mentioned will probably last awhile.

Now for the bad news. You have shown us a picture of an area that has thick paint or epoxy. This is covering a possible can of worms. I would remove all coating all around and see what you have. We can't really advise until the whole picture is exposed. You don't even know how bad that one area is yet.

Here is a tutorial on how to fabricate such/similar corner patches using MINIMAL tools..



https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3511705&postcount=401

Robert to the rescue (again).

Bartamos, It looked to me like the area had already been sandblasted and primed. If that's not the case, then blasting the paint off would be the first order of business. If already blasted, JB Weld could be applied over the primer (assuming it's epoxy).

If someone wants to fill small holes and smooth, body filler is the product to use, not JB Weld.

Why not? Epoxy over epoxy primer shouldn't be an issue, although JB Weld tends to sag a bit on vertical surfaces.

I disagree 100%. Especially where water is likely to be wicked in over time. Body filler is nothing but a weak 2 part resin mixed with talc. Also it isn't uncommon to be left with a relatively porous finished product, especially where it goes through holes. J-B Weld is infinitely workable, is very non-porous when cured and will do a much better job. Besides this is an area with small ledges and lips. That's perfect for working with J-B Weld and if you're careful, you probably won't have all that much sanding to do. If you start MIG welding, it won't be long before you discover the seam where the top joins the pillar was paddled with lead when the truck was built...and you'll get to re-do all that work now that you've melted it.

If you are at 100%. No use discussing. OP choice.

If you're advocating body filler, you should let the OP know why you say that so he has all the information needed to make an educated choice.
Maybe you're right, but he won't know unless you say why you think it's the proper choice.

During my career in the Nuclear industry, I used a two part metal repair epoxy called Belzona to repair pump casings and heat exchangers damaged by cavitation, electrolysis or just plain negligence. This was the industry’s cure for long lead time parts on a temporary basis. Industrial, excessively expensive and extremely effective. One of the tricks I used to keep epoxy in place was to make temporary forms or dams. Made of wood or plastic or pretty much anything, to duplicate the surface that you wanted to achieve, then waxed with a paste wax such as Johnson’s to keep it from sticking. Once cured, it would simply pry off. The wax coating would allow the form to release creating a near perfect surface, In most cases, I didn’t need to clamp in place as the suction created when you press it in place was enough to keep the dam in place, I would think this method would work on JB Weld or other epoxy or even bondo.

I would make it similar to the edited picture. If you can match the thickness from the face of the lip to where the outer part of the gasket sits, you can use the face of the wood as a guide to smooth out the gasket surface. Press the epoxy into all of the little crevices first then build up slightly higher than you need, press the form in, clamp if you need then let it cure. Cleanup will be minimal.

POR-15 Epoxy Putty Industrial Strength Pliable Metal Filler
'Unbelievable', that's what restorers say when they see a demonstration of the incredible POR-15 Epoxy Putty.

It's so strong you can drill and tap it, yet gentle enough that you can apply it with your fingers.

You can simply wet your fingers, and work with it until it is almost perfectly smooth before it dries - eliminating most sanding! But when it cures, it's Rock Hard, making it perfect for repairing steel, plastics, concrete, etc. Amazingly, it even sticks to damp surfaces, and will cure Underwater, so it can be used to fix leaking basement walls, swimming pools, plumbing fixtures and so much more. Put some POR-15 Epoxy Putty In your toolbox today. You'll find yourself using it all over your shop and home.

Mixes Like Clay, Hardens Like Steel
Stays in Place, Moldable Consistency
Cures Chemically
Resistant to Shrinking and Cracking
Can be Sanded, Drilled, Sawed, Painted

Wow Robert...my left lower window frame thanks you. I have been looking for something just like this without much luck. A very well put together tutorial. I will probably use some of the other methods as well on the areas that are not so bad.

Thanks everyone and thanks Eric for posting.

After I explain why I say use body filler or weld and body filler, it will just continue the wizzing contest. I can not tell the extent of the, so called, rot. I need to see the bare metal, as does the poster. What I see does not seem to need a fabbed piece. It does not seem to be structural. Cosmetically, it will be hidden. It does not seem to be ready to break off. But not sure. It seems like it just needs smoothed so that the windshield will seal.

Body filler is a two part compound especially made for auto body metal smoothing. It mixes to a nice spreadable consistency, easy to apply and easy to sand. It will fill small holes. It is used by professional body persons worldwide. They don't use JB Weld for body work. JB Weld is not for that. Too thick, too messy, to globby, not smooth, harder to shape and sand. The real question is not for me, it's why use all these other ideas. Why not body filler? That is what it is for. There is nothing better or easier. It won't take much.

The choices, depending on what is found, are:
1. Body filler
2. Weld a little and body filler
3. Weld in a new piece and body filler
4. Solder or lead it

I will repeat, it's the OP's choice.

There are probably better words than "smoothing" but you know what I mean.

Don't forget, weld in a new piece and metal work it, (No fillers involved.) Oh, there is also the "fiberglass it" crowd. And the "ignore it" crowd. Just don't be the "foam fill it" crowd!!

Thanks Bartamos for explaining. All opinions are welcome. I don't think anyone is unzipped here.

MNS: You forgot my crowd. Duct Tapers Anonymous. Of which I am president (anonymously). Thank you and good day.

And let’s not forget the “HVAC AluminumTape” then cover it with bondo crowd.

The cab was sand blasted and epoxy primed some time ago and this is one of the last areas that need fixing prior to cab metal work being completed. I think if I was to attempt to fill it with MIG welding I would likely blow more holes in it and make it worse. I can get behind some of it with a copper backing but not all of it. The metal fabrication is very tempting for the sake of learning more but to be honest Im really contemplating the filling it approach....I can't believe I said that. I told myself I would only apply a skim coat for final finish where needed but this is such a small area and it isn't like a thick patch of bondo on the exterior plus it is sandwiched between the rubber seal so that should provide some protection from exposure and trap it in place.

Thanks everyone, as usual this group knocked it out of the park with great options and comments. There is no way I could have got this far on the project without this forum!

You could lead the area !Eastwood has some nice leading supplies. The area is so small ,

https://www.eastwood.com/autobody/leading-body-solder.html

I learned to lead when I went to trade school to learn Auto Body. It is definitely an art that can’t be taught by watching videos but is more of an OJT skill. First, the area to be leaded must be spotlessly clean down to bare metal. The only way to accomplish this (this area on your truck) would be to sandblast the area. Next, you need a tinning compound and have the area tinned completely as lead won’t stick to bare metal. Horizontal areas are much easier than vertical areas. The lead will puddle on horizontal areas but will run on verticals. Run is an understatement as the heat is very critical on verticals. Not enough heat and the lead doesn’t bond. Too much heat and you’ll loose most of your whole leading job and I mean not just the area you were heating but most of the lead you applied will literally fall to the floor and you get to start all over. You’ll set your OA torch to a wide flame similar to brazing but wider, unlike the pin point flame for welding. The heat range is critical and small. Once you reach you ideal temperature, you fan the torch (apply heat to the area your working then take it off to keep it at that temperature). Once you start to apply lead, you’ll need a special lead paddle to move the lead around because it doesn’t flow. Heat the area, melt a bit of lead, remove the heat and paddle the lead around until it starts to solidify then heat again. Repeat as required. You also have to watch that your not heating the surrounding area too much that you warp the panel. The paddle working surface, is kept oiled by an oil soaked rag that you lay the paddle on, which helps to glide the paddle across the surface.

Now I know what you’re all thinking. How does an oil soaked paddle not contaminate the lead. Once the metal is tinned, the lead sticks and the oil is not an issue. Now mind you, I have not leaded in over 40 years, but this is one area in autobody that I don’t believe has changed much.

The point that I am trying to make is, if you have not done this type of repair, its best left to someone that has. It will be very frustrating trying to learn this skill on your first job and more that likely you will not be happy with the results.

If that was my truck, I would probe the area with a pick to see if it is sound, then make a determination from there. If it is sound, I would rough up the existing epoxy and do a bondo repair as Bartamos has suggested. Once the repaired area is primed and painted, there will be no issues with the porous bondo. If its not sound, then replacing the metal is your only choice.

The old school route of leading would work too. It's not that hard and a kit can bought from eastwood. I did some leading and filled in holes exactly like those on a 65' olds 442 around the windshield pinch welds I'm restoring for my brother. First time for me.

I vote lead it. I leaded mine on my 1959 apache, if you can understand how to solder you can lead those pits and small holes. I use bees wax as as the paddle lubricant and the you can achieve a very smooth surface.

I vote lead it. I leaded mine on my 1959 apache, if you can understand how to solder you can lead those pits and small holes. I use bees wax as as the paddle lubricant and the you can achieve a very smooth surface. The tricky part is tinning the base metal but a tinning compound makes that fairly easy too.

22 years ago I used 3M Auto Panelbond Adhesive to fill some rust-out on a door bottom. It's a 2-part epoxy they use to glue new cars together instead of welding. It still looks perfect today.

Using JB Weld, in the time it's taken me to read this thread you could have already had that thing fixed.

If you do decide to lead it, please be aware that the acid in the flux will migrate to the back side of the pin holes and will need to be neutralized, or it will rust from the inside out.

Another reason to use JB Weld or body filler. Either can go right over the existing epoxy primer. Mike said it had already been blasted.
Why make things harder than they need to be? Unless you want to become the expert on lead patching, I'd leave that alone.

Precisely.

Dongray has gracefully thanked everyone and is moving forward. The rest of you are showing lockdown syndrome. Seems folks are either attacking him or attacking the post? Time to do some Christmas shopping or something, Aye?