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#1335660 11/28/2019 8:31 PM
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I'd like some honest opinions on the topic here, and please dont hold back. Ive researched it to death and there is just very little on the net.

I finally got the brakes on the old girl ('64 C60) fixed up and got her on the road today. Ran her to town, and up and down the county roads for ~1.5 hours, working the crud out. Before I left oil was just over the full line. As I pulled back in the shop I let her cool off and checked again. Oil was down to the "add" line indicating I'm 1.5-2 quarts low. She's burning a LOT of oil.

I can see oil down the side of the engine and clearly the valve cover is leaking, but not enough to be that low that quick. She doesn't smoke like a diesel on a cold morning, but she smokes pretty good. I'm at a crossroad now with three directions.

Option 1: Run as is. Keep a case of oil in the cab and refill after every few hours. It's a 140mi round trip between the farms and in this girl, a good 1.75-2 hours. Thats a lot of oil to be replacing if im making the run once a week and expensive for oil then.

Option 2: Pull and rebuild the 292. Without knowing condition of the cylinders (low compression), this could be quick/easy/cheap or it could be a headache and long/expensive. Consider a full bottom end rebuild and new carb and everything (it's needs it).

Option 3: Speed-up my timeline and Repower sooner to a Detroit. I found a running 6v53N about 3 hours away. Its not the turbo model i wanted, but its plenty suited for the job. Its the end goal for better mileage workhorse capacity, but money up front (road ranger's aren't cheap) and this wasn't planned for another year-ish.

So let's hear it. What do you all think? I'm not trying to keep it authentic, just trying to run her good so I can work her like she was ment to be.

Last edited by HFfarms; 11/28/2019 10:45 PM.

1964 Chevrolet C60 Real Farm Truck
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Since your going to in a year anyway, bite the bullet and repower now. Call it an early Christmas present.🛠


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A DD will require a close ratio trans.(RR would be good choice) I have two, plus Brownie or high rear ratios(hard to find). Plus some mount work. Sort of depends on end use. Unknown DD might burn as much oil as now. Other option would be to major 292 and use it until can get necessary DD parts in line-might take a year or so. Then can sell majored 292 for cash.

Ed


'37 GMC T-18 w/ DD 4-53T, RTO-610, 6231 aux., '95 GMC running gear, full disc brakes, power steering, 22.5 wheels and tires.
'47 GMC 1 ton w/ 302, NP-540, 4wd, full width Blazer front axle.
'54 GMC 630 w/ 503 gasser, 5 speed, ex fire truck, shortened WB 4', install 8' bed.
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If the 292 has been sitting for a while, the rings are likely stuck (yes they could be worn out as well) and the valve seals could be bad. If the rings are stuck, they may loosen with time and the oil use fall a lot. If the valve seals are bad you should get smoke on start up after a warmed up run. Valve seals are easy, so are cover gaskets. Putting a couple hundred more miles on the engine will free the rings if they are gonna come free, and slow the oil use. Change the high quality oil often enough to keep it clean during this running, like every couple hundred miles. All this is pretty easy and may show you that no more serious work is needed.

Changing to a low speed diesel means changing the whole drive line as mentioned above, a very big project with lot of time and money.

I would go with minor work on the the 292, if it still smokes then major it. Forget the engine swap unless you decide you need more power, then go with gas to avoid the whole driveline issue.

It's your truck, do what you want. Great truck!

Last edited by sweepleader; 11/29/2019 12:39 AM.

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I agree, I wouldn't give up on the 292 just yet. Run it for a while and see what happens. After a "re-break" in and another oil change as sweepleader recommended, check the Compression. Maybe even add a can of STP in it. Change the Valve Cover Gasket and check the Side Covers in the meantime. Time will tell if it's worth keeping or not.

As much as I am a Detroit Diesel fan, a 6V-53 is not a good choice for your '64 C-60. A 4-53, especially a 4-53T would be a better choice (It will fit a whole lot better and it's also a whole lot lighter). But then you may also have to change the Rear as you may find that your top speed may be pretty low.

But again, I would give the 292 a good try.

Keep us posted on it.

Last edited by C10 - C90 Bill; 11/29/2019 2:23 AM.

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Repower, but run, do not walk away from the Detroit unless you're willing to swap the entire running gear, including the front axle and springs to handle the extra weight of the Diesel engine. A 4-53 would be about the biggest Detroit you can fit comfortably into that engine compartment, which would probably have less usable torque than the 292 and like most Detroits, it would have to be run up against the governor all the time to make enough power to get out of its own way.

If you're swapping engines and you want mores power, there are plenty of 454's available that will make more power than the 292 without re-engineering the entire gear train as well.
Jerry


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Originally Posted by sweepleader
If the 292 has been sitting for a while, the rings are likely stuck (yes they could be worn out as well) and the valve seals could be bad. If the rings are stuck, they may loosen with time and the oil use fall a lot. If the valve seals are bad you should get smoke on start up after a warmed up run. Valve seals are easy, so are cover gaskets. Putting a couple hundred more miles on the engine will free the rings if they are gonna come free, and slow the oil use. Change the high quality oil often enough to keep it clean during this running, like every couple hundred miles. All this is pretty easy and may show you that no more serious work is needed.

This I have never heard of, and it makes sense. To clarify, it isn't billowing smoke. Its like an old engine with some seafoam in the tank that smokes out of the exhaust. After 15-20 minutes the shop can get a little hazy. But, down almost 2 qts in 1.5 hours and maybe 40ish miles has me wondering.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=420315 Down on post 8 of this explains another way to troubleshoot by removing the PCV and seeing if any smoke comes out of the valve cover. Ill test this on Saturday and then put her back on the road and run her somewhat hard while watching oil levels. I need to pull and check the plugs too for oil fouling. If I can get the 292 to run thru to the summer ill be happy. This puppy is suuuuuuucking fuel like a drunk sucks down booze too. I know the carb is a bit goobered, but phew, its extra thirsty.


I understand the hesitation and drawbacks of the DD. I fully intend on fabricating and going all out though. Haven't yet looked at rear end ratio's but am crunching numbers on either a 10 or 13 speed RR and possibly a brownie. Still figuring. Good call on the 4-53 though, I still need to take some measurements. The thought process of the DD is that this truck will roll around pretty heavily loaded most of the time and nothing beats a DD pegged out under load. Not the most powerful, but longevity wise it wins out. No need to monitor egt's like with a cummins or worry about the issues of the DT466 and CAT3208. I could drop in a 454 or 427, but the increased mileage of a diesel swap should offset operational fuel costs pretty quick.


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A well tuned 292 should get good gas mileage. My '64 C-30 got probably around 12-15. Fully loaded with a 5,000 Lb load didn't seem to make much of a difference. Maybe brought it down to 11-14. But I also believe it letting it breathe. I always ran a straight-thru muffler on it.

If you go with a Detroit and if you go with an Overdrive trans, you may not have to change the rear. May just work out just fine. I roughly checked the numbers and it looks like a 4-53T would weigh about 750 Lbs more than a 292-6. I believe some heavier Front Springs (maybe just add some Leafs) should handle it.

By the way, what is the GVW on your C-60?


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Originally Posted by C10 - C90 Bill
A well tuned 292 should get good gas mileage. I always ran a straight-thru muffler on it.

By the way, what is the GVW on your C-60?

This girl is the 19,500 lb gvw. She's pretty heavy and rides like a tank as is.

I'm hacking off the muffler tomorrow and just running a straighpipe in its place for now. Ran out of time for that yesterday. What's your definition of a good tune?

Also, could a heavier weight oil prevent the consumption. Given the cold weather out ive got 10w30 in the motor as per factory manual. Maybe a 40 weight would be better and less prone to burning off?


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I would always run 10-40 in mine. A good tune would be new Plugs, Wires (if needed), Points and Condenser, Adjust the Timing a little Advanced (as long as it doesn't ping), clean the Carb (spray clean with it running should do) and adjust the Carb to the Highest Vacuum. Also your PCV Valve, Air Filter, Fuel Filter, etc.

The GVW of 19,500 is a little low for a C-60. Are you sure it's not a C-50? If you do go with a Detroit and heavier trans someday, you will lose about another 1000 Lbs off of your hauling capacity if you want to stay under the legal limits.

Keep us posted on your progress.


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Yeah she is a 60 series as per badging and id card from the glove box. All C60's used the same frame right? Just spit balling here, but an axle replacement (front & rear) would then up the GVW to a higher range safely (barring mfg tag). Most DOT and such here in IN don't bother with GVW tags, they inspect axle & tire ratings in conjunction with curb and load weight. Plus farm plates further help out. I planned on titling at the 24-26K range since lord knows she'll be overloaded on occasion.

I did plugs and wires the day I picked her up and have fiddled with the carb now. With the crud run out the carb is doing better, but she has to run 10-15 minutes at half to quarter choke from a cold start to stay running. At this point I'll just slap a new reman on it, BUT only if I am going to continue to run this 292.

Im calling local truck yards today for DD availability and pricing just so im covering all bases of my options.


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I have a spare 4-53T.

Ed


'37 GMC T-18 w/ DD 4-53T, RTO-610, 6231 aux., '95 GMC running gear, full disc brakes, power steering, 22.5 wheels and tires.
'47 GMC 1 ton w/ 302, NP-540, 4wd, full width Blazer front axle.
'54 GMC 630 w/ 503 gasser, 5 speed, ex fire truck, shortened WB 4', install 8' bed.
'55 GMC 370 w/270, 420 4 speed, grain, dump bed truck from ND. Works OK.
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Update:

In the process of building the bed I blew the driver steer tire (RH5 wheels) so the trucks been up for a bit while I was hunting for wheels. Located 4 ring splits, so only the inner dual RH5's remain. Was able to get on the road again last weekend and run her. Smoking is down, but oil consumption remains. Got back in the shop and dug around underneath to find oil seeping from the bell housing drain hole, so the rear main is shot and i've got to pull the 292.

Since its out, figure I may as well dress it from top to bottom and attend to the trans and clutch. Figure its a better option right now to rebuild/run the 292 (wont cost much) and slowly amass what I need for the re-power. Pushes the timeline to the right, but keeps the truck working and earning money and allows more time to plan and shop junkyards.

Engine pull is happening in a different shop so I am out of the way of the dozer's and excavator's winter maintenance. So yesterday I topped off fluids, gave her the once over, loaded up, and set off on the long 2 hour drive. Stopped once to top off oil and check brakes. She had no issues and purred at steady rpm and 47 mph. I got a lot of looks, some waves, a couple thumbs up, and a lot of middle fingers from the backed up traffic, but all in all, despite the cold and lack of functioning heater, it was a very enjoyable drive. Shes parked at my farm now before she makes the last leg of the journey westward toward a fresh engine and drive-line.

Couldn't help but laugh at all the middle fingers for my "slow driving." Its sad really, but then again those people will never know the enjoyment of banging the gears up to a slow roll and enjoying the world going by just a bit slower and a lot less hectic.

[img]https://i.imgur.com/0PWNx66.jpg[/img]


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Thanks for sharing,love the truck,Pat

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Neat picture. I looks like it's loaded with a silo.


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Some really good info on the pros/cons of re-powering vs rebuilding the truck engine has been supplied in this thread.
From my point of view I would opt for staying with the 292. I would pursue two options: One, look around for a good used 292, there are a lot of them out there that people have pulled in favor of a SBC or BBC. Number two would be a complete rebuild a 292, either the engine you have or a used 292. Re-building a replacement engine would speed up the down time.
A couple guys mentioned the PCV,, many people are unaware how much oil a faulty PCV can suck up.
Re-powering a truck with a DD or any other diesel can be a bottomless pit. If you look around in the truck wrecking yards you should be able to find a Clark 5spd trans, the 5th gear is an OD in lieu of direct. The Clark 5 spd's were common in school buses. There are other 5 spd OD transmissions from the 1960/70's. I had a '72 GMC 5500 for many years that had one, a great truck.. Another option is a 2 spd rear end..
Several years ago I had a 73 Chevy C20 that had a 454 V8, it was classified as a gross polluter, it sucked up fuel at the rate of 7-8 mpg, had to have it smog certified every year.
A friend of mine had a similar truck with a SBC, he had it converted to a 700R4 OD trans. The cost was $2,800. His mileage improved to 10-12, he was a happy camper. I ran the numbers through my machine, at the then price of of fuel, right at 5.00 a gal., the numbers came up that it would take 60k miles of driving to break even on the conversion cost. I sold my '73. Wm.


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Originally Posted by Wm L
If you look around in the truck wrecking yards you should be able to find a Clark 5spd trans, the 5th gear is an OD in lieu of direct.

Not all Clark 5-speeds are OD transmissions, they built a lot of DD 5-speeds as well.

Mike B smile

Last edited by John Milliman; 03/27/2020 5:15 PM. Reason: Correct a contradiction, clarify the meaning

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I was considering one of the OD Clarks for my firetruck till I found out that they rearrange things inside and use the 3rd spot for the OD, making a huge ratio step from second to 4th (the new 3rd). There ain't no free lunch I guess.


Mac :{)

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Originally Posted by Mike B
All Clark 5-speeds are not OD transmissions, they built a lot of DD 5-speeds as well.

Mike B smile

Correct. In fact its not all that easy to locate a 5 speed OD version, at least not here in the Midwest where most of these were grain trucks that didn't need OD.

Originally Posted by sweepleader
I was considering one of the OD Clarks for my firetruck till I found out that they rearrange things inside and use the 3rd spot for the OD, making a huge ratio step from second to 4th (the new 3rd). There ain't no free lunch I guess.

I found the same info. The only good way to do it is with a 2 or 3 speed brownie on the back of the main, but with a 2 speed rear, now your talking 15+ forward gears. I personally wouldn't mind one of the DD 5 speeds. Those two extra gears would be very helpful when loaded.


Front clip is apart and the engine is coming out tonight. Time to dig in a see if the block needs punched out or just honed. Since its apart, im diving in with 100% new brake system overhaul and 100% rewire. Any advice on radiator rebuild vice replacement?
[img]https://i.imgur.com/2CbsMGw.jpg[/img]

Last edited by HFfarms; 02/18/2020 1:40 PM.

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Many 2 speed rears are pretty low, so check carefully on the ratio before you get one. I replaced a 6.5 single speed with a 4.13 two speed, made a tremendous difference.

I agree with Sweepleader, most light truck 5 speeds have that big gap where 3rd used to be, most originally came with a 2 speed rear which would help. I put brownies in where driveline length allows.

Ed


'37 GMC T-18 w/ DD 4-53T, RTO-610, 6231 aux., '95 GMC running gear, full disc brakes, power steering, 22.5 wheels and tires.
'47 GMC 1 ton w/ 302, NP-540, 4wd, full width Blazer front axle.
'54 GMC 630 w/ 503 gasser, 5 speed, ex fire truck, shortened WB 4', install 8' bed.
'55 GMC 370 w/270, 420 4 speed, grain, dump bed truck from ND. Works OK.
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Figured I would update. Barring the myrid of problems with the brake system (different topic) everything has gone mostly smoothly. Yanked the motor and trans in late Feb. and upon pulling the head, found a .020-.030 wear ring on every cylinder. This wasn't a case of stuck rings, this old girl was just worn out. Definitely a 200k+ mile motor. Broke her done, dropped her off at the engine shop with all the 50-60 year old guys who know these motors, left instructions for what I was wanting, and focused back on brakes and electrical.

A month later and the engine is back. Punched .040 over, new RV cam, head machined for better squish, HD valves, and new from the ground up. Couldn't find the original color paint, so just went with DD Alpine Blue to match the truck. The block had a slight crack between cylinder 2-3 on the cooling sleeve that had seeped water at one time and caused some rust. Given that we drained full coolant during engine pull, I assumed that she was run hot and hard one day which caused it, seeped water, and then the block effectively self sealed. The builder patched it and put a block of sealer in the engine as well.

My questions for those of you more well versed in these puppy's:
- What additional care do I need to take for the block? Given that the truck will see more use in the winter (upper midwest winters) is it viable to run block heaters to prewarm the engine prior to starting to lessen thermal shock to the block?
- The builder did not use hardened valve seats. I spoke to him about it and he explained that the hardened valve seats really come into play with higher RPM setups and excess time spent at the higher end. Given that the engine is a low RPM grunter in a big truck, the hardened seats aren't necessary. I heeded his advice as he has been building these suckers for nearly 50 years. Should I be worried? Is there additional additives/steps to take for care for non-hardened valve seats?
- I have zinc additive for the oil to break in the new cam. Beyond that, is anything else advised?
- I asked the builder and he indicated that conventional oil is best for these engines. With a rebuild, are the factory weights still advisable or is a different weight more modern oil best? I had 5w30 in her for cold weather but then swapped to SAE40. Should I stick with SAE40 even with cold weather?

I appreciate and input and advice as I continue to learn these trucks. I am still awaiting trans (figured she should be freshened up since shes out) and then HEI and a number of small parts, and then she is going back together, hopefully soon given the excessive time I now have due to COVID-19. Looking forward to getting this girl back on the road.
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I am not an expert on these engines but I have had extended cold weather experience in Minnesota, about 50 years of driving. SAE 40 will lead to difficult starting without preheating, and could lead to loss of oil pressure at the far ends of the oiling system. Extended warm up times can cause drain back problems with attendant pump problems. Preheating will help with starting and oiling all systems in the engine. I can see no reason for using heavy oil in a "new" motor. I would say you have the breakin lube situation covered and suggest that for at least the first couple of oil changes that you check the oil filter for metal.

I would stick with the builders recommendations on oil type and weight. Main bearing clearances are the most important factor in oil weight, with cold starts second in my view. I run 20W50 in my 1967 400 cid SBC but it is not run in the winter. It does have large main clearances for more flow for more bearing cooling, on the recommendation of my engine builder.

The block sealer sounds like a good idea any time you change the coolant, you may need to flush your heater core as it tends to filter the coolant and clog. I would not worry about the valve seats, additives for the fuel are available if you want to spend the money for them. In some areas of the country they are not legal for road use.

My thoughts are not definitive, only opinions.


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Straight 40 weight oil is going to be a bit thick for cold starting in yankee-land. I'd recommend 15W-40 Diesel rated oil, as it flows like a 15 weight when cold, and lubricates like a 40 weight when hot. BTW, the "W" in multi grade oil nomenclature doesn't stand for "weight"- - - -it means "winter" since the cold flow characteristics are measured at freezing temperatures. I agree with your builder's opinion of hard exhaust seats- - - - -they're only necessary when running "dry" fuels like LP or CNG.
Jerry


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Appreciate the info. Ill talk with the builder to see specifically what he suggests weight wise. 5w30 as the factory manual suggests just sounds too thin to me on a big engine, and I like the sound of 10x40 or 15w40.

Sweepleader, with your extensive experience up here in the cold, any suggesting on block warmer? I install and run them on the newer Silverados, but I opt for OEM. Kats heaters just don't seem to have a lot of good reviews. There is Zerostart as well, but there's almost no reviews anywhere. One thing I did see was installing 2 block heaters in the event that one fails you have a backup before you have to drain the coolant and replace. I figure ill install the heaters now wile the engine is on the stand and frost plugs are easy to punch out. Just not sure which route to take.


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I understand your concerns about the oil weight but the bearing clearances not displacement determine which oil is best. Tight clearances need lighter oils, and modern oils are very good, much better than when the engine was designed. Heavy oils cost starting problems and fuel economy unnecessarily.

I have installed a lot of block heaters but I do not have an opinion on which is better. Most have been sourced from NAPA with unknown manufacturers, most have been completely reliable. The factory installed ones have been in exactly the same reliability class as the aftermarket in my experience. No OEM makes their own, they are all purchased out, so I see no reason to expect any difference. The real problems come from owner malfunctions, damaged cords, failure to maintain the coolant in good shape, installation errors, things like that. The OEM in my current truck is 20 years old and still works fine.

There really seems to be no reason to consider installing two, unless in an extreme case the extra heat is needed. One 600 - 650 watt unit should be plenty down to about -20F. The failure rate is so low that the problems associated with installing a second heater would keep me from doing it. The reasons for failure of the first unit generally apply to the second so if one failed, the back up would likely as not be failed too or soon after.

Also, many engines only have one location suitable for a heater, I am not sure if your engine is that way. Often there is an exhaust feature or the starter or other item blocking the outside, or a cylinder wall blocking the inside of a certain apparently convenient core hole. The one that is easiest to get at and would be ideal from an installation point of view is usually blocked internally, no room for the heating element. If the exhaust is close, I would suggest a heat shield to protect the heater parts. You will not be able to pick and choose the location you would like to use.

It might actually be getting difficult to find a heater for an engine as old as yours, I would expect that unless the same unit fits newer models, no one has made one for many years. It is also possible that heaters that would fit are not listed as such anymore, the catalogues have been changed to drop out the old applications whether or not the unit fits. You might have to go with trial and error for fit, or try to find an old book. The heater manufacturers might be helpful with fitment suggestions.

On the stand installation is a very good idea, some installations in the vehicle are quite difficult. Silicone in the hole and the o-ring areas of the heater will preclude leaks. The hole should not be painted as that will likely prevent the heater from entering, they generally fit very closely.

When all other efforts fail, a lower hose heater, a glue on heater or an external "tank" heater could settle the issue. There are magnetic heaters as well but they are of low wattage to protect the magnet and not really suitable for low temperatures. All of these have their own problems, the frost plug heater is the way to go if you can arrange it.

A properly installed heater usually would not need to be run over night. I put a timer on the outlet I use and set it for 3 hours before I plan on starting. The 600 watt heater in my V8 warms things up enough in that time to make starting a non issue and it saves a lot on the cost of running the heater.


Mac :{)

1962 K10 short step side, much modified for rally
1969 T50 fire truck, almost nos, needs a few things
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 146
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Thanks for the input Sweeplander. Research shows the best location for a core plug (frost plug) heater is the one directly below the exhaust and carb location in the center of the engine. This would put it relatively close to the location where the crack in the block was which is the additional side effect of what im looking at. Props on the heat shield point, ill be sure to manufacture one to keep the exhaust heat off the heater end and cord. If I do a second, it wold be same side and the next one forward within proximity of the crack. Im looking more so to alleviate thermal shock and engine wear with the heaters as opposed to just quick warm-up and in cab heat times. What is it, 80% of engine wear occurs at <90 deg F temps? Given the road time she'll see every winter, anything to minimize that is a good investment in my book.

Im not too worried on locating a heater, both Kats and Zerostart have friction fit systems in a variety of sizes, so I am sure I can locate one to work. I run all the Silverados on a 4 hour timer cycle typically starting between 1 and 2 am to ensure they are warm by 5-6 when the wife and I leave. Those at 650 watt heaters that keep the engine at ~60 deg F with outside temps of 0 F. Ill have a separate timer and retractable cord for the C60 rigged up on board for similar setup to run for a few hours prior to start based on wattage.

An oil pan magnetic heater I would use maybe a handful off times in a year in sub-zero temps, but even then its not necessarily worth it and any affect it could have can be also obtained by using the right oil. Im not a fan of lower rad hose heaters and such. The best place to put the heat is right to the block, and there's really no substitute for plug heaters in that case.

Ill shop indiscriminately on brand and talk to NAPA if need be and see what I can find.


1964 Chevrolet C60 Real Farm Truck
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I would not worry about thermal shock regards your crack as much as I would about heat cycles. In light of the problems that Cadillac and others have had with coolant/compression leaks, the sealer in the coolant idea seems prudent for your case.

If the cooling system stays full and in good order, there would seem to be little reason to worry about shocking the block with heat. Surface temperatures in the combustion temperatures have been published as high as 500 to 800F when the coolant is 195F. Higher loads would lead to higher surface temperatures. Of course it takes a while for the coolant to get warm, but if you start at -10F and open the throttle for full load, you have added a lot to the differential. The differential temp is what would cause the crack to open/progress. I would think that simply warming the engine by whatever method is available 50 or more degrees is about all that can be done beyond not loading the engine until it is actually up to temp. There was a semi owner/operator I used to know that insisted on running his truck below 10 mph for a couple of miles to warm it up. I think that is extreme but I am sure you get the idea.

Full synthetic oils have proven to be very helpful at low as well as high temperatures. We did a test one night when it went to about -25F some years back, the synthetic was the only oil that could be poured out of its plastic quart bottle. That means starting and oiling would be much improved over petroleum oils. A friend replaced petroleum oil in his race truck transfer case and eliminated oil related failures. I am not certain that the cost, which is coming down these days, will always justify switching but synthetic is something to consider.


Mac :{)

1962 K10 short step side, much modified for rally
1969 T50 fire truck, almost nos, needs a few things
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 854
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One winter when we had a ridiculous cold snap that lasted a couple of weeks, I was on a tour of back-country homesteads, read off-grid. No chance for electric block heaters. So, every evening at shut-down, I lit the Dietz lantern and slid it under the oil pan, then folded the army blanket over a few times and threw it over the still warm engine. The radiator was blocked with cardboard already. Then I unhooked the battery cables and brought it in the house and set it near the stove. Next morning I reversed the procedure and the old 235 fired right up.

Last night of the tour, I was tired and didn't bring the battery in. Wouldn't you know, it went to 30 below. Next morning, no starter action. Even though it was parked on a slight down-grade four of us couldn't budge it. Eventually, the county road crew came by and we threw out a chain. They pulled us about 50 ft. and it was off and running.

Though the deluxe heater worked, I really wished for the recirculating option.


1951 3800 1-ton
"Earning its keep from the get-go"
In the DITY Gallery
1962 261 (w/cam, Fenton headers, 2 carbs, MSD ign.), SM420 & Brown-Lipe 6231A 3spd aux. trans, stock axles & brakes. Owned since 1971.
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I wanted to update.

On Sunday she fired, on Monday she moved (fantastic birthday present), and yesterday she hit the road and did ~20 miles. ITS ALIVE!

I sat down and started last Thursday afternoon with an assembled crank, head, and trans and didn't stop until last night, 12-16 hours a day grinding away on the old girl. And here she sits! Since she was apart, I went ahead and did a number of things as well:

- Overhauled the SM420. New bearings, new synchros, the whole shebang
- All new heavy clutch and throw out bearing
- All stainless brake lines front to back
- 100% new brakes and wheel cylinders on the front
- New master modified for the high pressure return of the 12.75" hydrovac
- New thermostat and hoses
- New motor mounts. Took forever to figure out that the 292 uses standard V8 motor mounts. Yup, the info took forever to find so ill state it here again. The 292 uses V8 motor mounts.
- New fuel system to include filler neck and filler neck grommet
- New diaphragm on the vacuum shift
- New primary wiring done. Still have to rewire the rest of the truck but that is easy and I can tackle that in my one barn/shop

- Original 292 bored .040 over
- New cam
- New oil pump
- New lifters
- New valves and valve seats
- New rockers
- New push-rods
- New timing gear and chain
- New points distributor

She has the original water pump as '64 292 water pumps cannot be had, so one of the coming mods will be migrating to a '65 water pump and the necessary changes it will bring. She has the original exhaust still temporarily until I can get a shop to do the mandrel bent stainless with a glasspack. The Napa I was using continually fell short, and never sent off my hydrovac for rebuild, so its back on the truck so I can get her back to my farm and then I personally will make the calls and do the work to get it refreshed.

I opted to stay with points for simplicity and the ability to fix on the roadside. Ill upgrade to HEI later, but for now I want to learn points inside and out so I can always fall back on it when/if needed.

The newly rebuilt Rochester carb I purchased (I refused to send my old on in) flat does not work. Even at the lowest possible adjustment, idle is maintained at 1500 rpm and the throttle jets are all screwed up as it takes 5-6 seconds after release of the throttle for the carb to actually throttle down. Quite frustrated, I yanked the sucker off, pulled out the old Rochester, slapped it in, adjusted the vacuum advance and mixture screw while backing out out the idle screw and voila, that 292 just purrs. The the throttle jet is just a bit sticky as she hesitates momentarily under heavy throttle from idle, but that's a tinker job "for tomorrow."

All that's left is the rear axle and drive-line. I have new wheel cylinders for the rear, new carrier bearing, new u-joints, and new seals. The diff needs flushed and inspected as she still will not shift from 3 hi to 4 lo and it is not a vacuum issue, so it is something mechanical in the rear end.

I know i've said it before, but again, a MASSIVE THANK YOU to this forum and those of you here. The wealth of knowledge is indispensable and a direct reason that as a young guy with zero experience or family background in auto-anything, I was able to figure this out and do it all myself. The things I have learned in this process, both on parts and old GM engineering, I am actively applying and helping others with nearly daily at this point. And im looking for my next big bolt now! (hopefully a '59 Spartan 100)
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Last edited by HFfarms; 04/22/2020 6:31 PM.

1964 Chevrolet C60 Real Farm Truck
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'Bolter
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Fantastic job there, VERY nice.

The idle problem with the new carb might be the throttle plate being off center and hitting the bore before the plate goes shut. If you can see light at the edge of the plate when 'closed' it might be possible to loosen the screws in the throttle shaft holding the plate to center it in the bore. Just loosen the screws and wiggle the shaft until the plate centers, then tighten them. Do not attempt to remove them, they are staked in place and will break before coming out. That is to prevent them falling into the engine.

The accelerator pump may be bad or the float may be low causing the hesitation. The float level can be adjusted higher to reduce the time it takes for fuel to get flowing in the main jet system on acceleration. That delay is the main reason for the accelerator pump. Set to too high and the fuel consumption will skyrocket, the engine may flood easily.

Like I said, very nice. Thanks for sharing your story.


Mac :{)

1962 K10 short step side, much modified for rally
1969 T50 fire truck, almost nos, needs a few things

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