The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The HiPo Shop Buick Straight 8 Repower

I posed the following question on the Stovebolt forum almost 20 years ago and didn't get much response, as I recall. Maybe there will be more interest today.
For background; one of the first cars I really fell for was a 53 Buick Special 4-door with a Straight 8 and Dynaflow. I was about 9 when my folks bought it from my granddad. As far back as I can remember it was part of the family. Anyway, we kept it for about 3 years and traded it for a used Dodge. I have loved old Buicks, especially 1953s and Straight 8s ever since. For the past 30 or so years I have played around with Advance-Design pickups. Fast forward to 2020 and I'm thinking (again) about shoe horning a Buick 8 into an A-D truck.

Not the smaller 263 Special engine but the bigger 320 Roadmaster 8. Last year for it was 1952. The Roadmaster and Super got V8s for 1953 but the 263 continued one more year in the Special. I know the 320 Buick was used in some Flxible buses in the 40s and 50s with 4-speed and 5-speed transmissions. Some 5-speeds had 5th gear overdrive. Some of that stuff is still available...

I know, lots of hurdles to jump: motor mounts, radiator position, firewall clearance, clutch linkage, etc. Am I crazy? Comments? Thanks.

Sanity is not an option in the HiPo Forum. I cut my teeth on Buick straight eights. My dad was a die hard Buick man until I was in my mid 30s. Learned to drive on back country roads on the north edge of OKC in a 1950 Roadmaster w/3 on the tree. If you have access to a engine and the skill set and tools to do it, I say go for it.🛠

How about a 1951 straight eight flathead Pontiac?

Don

I know this is not a Truck, not even close, but it shows what folks are doing with these engines. I took this picture a few years ago at a local car show, I'm not a fan of Rat Rods but I did like the engine. It would be interesting to see it in a truck.

Yes Frank, you are indeed crazy. If you were closer to me, I would offer to dive in and help you every step of the way.
For me, the only thing cooler than an AD real close to original condition, would be one with a Buick Straight Eight in it!
BTW, I have met 30-40 Stovebolters in person and have yet to meet a sane one. During those moments, I have never felt more at home.

A 302 GMC has almost as many cubic inches, will fit.

Ed

We have put some long engines into AD trucks and it does take some knowledge, quite a bit of engineering/fabricating skill, and lots of patience. A real drawback of the Art Deco and Advanced Design trucks is they are already cramped for inside cab space so a recessed firewall is not the first choice. With an inline engine the factory recess in the firewall could be extended back but this would best be done if an automatic trans was used. The upper air baffle plate containing the hood latch can be notched and the "U" shaped core support replaced with frame side mounts as was done on the pictured Coca Cola truck with an inline 6 turbocharged diesel. On a half ton pickup increased front end weight must be considered. There is a man on this site that has put a Vortec 4200 Atlas engine in an AD which is IIRC close to the 34.5" length of of a 320 Buick straight eight. I have driven a 37 Buick Special with a 263 straight eight for about 40 years and know first hand how smooth they are and the low end torque is outstanding. They are NOT a hot rod engine as even the top horsepower of a 320 is 168 which is the same as a 1955 Chevy 265ci engine with a two barrel carb.

Upper air baffle notched all the way to hood latch plate:
[img]https://i.postimg.cc/dL6kY6kf/IMG-4399.jpg[/img]

[img]https://i.postimg.cc/xkMNW2Kv/IMG-4403.jpg[/img]

Firewall not altered:
[img]https://i.postimg.cc/ppS9rTCQ/IMG-4400.jpg[/img]

Before I was bitten by the "buy-American" bug (seemingly in a different lifetime) had a MGA with a blown 4 cylinder engine (typical), and an extra Jaguar 6 cylinder engine.

With more time on my hands than I have now had for years, I, with a friend, installed the Jaguar 6 and electric OD transmission in the MGA.

When installed, the shift knob was approximately 18 inches BEHIND the seat Linkage to make shifting possible was a nightmare. Once we were able to shift the transmission, found the front suspension did NOT like the weight of the Jaguar engine. And driveability was horrible.

Ended up undoing everything, found a rebuildable MGA engine to rebuild and install; and kept the Jaguar engine as a spare.

The whole project was an absolute exercise in futility!!!!! But one is only young once! Not sorry, because I learned a lot; but would NEVER consider doing it again. One often learns by making mistakes!

If you decide to do the project, do lots of homework, before you start.

Jon.

There are several modified Buicks around Nor Cal, will attach a shot from a gathering few years back.

Just a guess: the 320 is about 8-1/2" longer (water pump nose to bellhousing pattern) than similar L6 engines.
Is there room to move the radiator forward?

These (and any long crankshaft) are at risk of harmonic damage, a quality aftermarket damper is a good investment.

Well we'll just have to put the Straight Eight Buick in the bed and make it a front wheel drive. We're doing it! Who's with me?!

Thanks for all your encouragement and a reality check.

Cars have been built with the radiator concealed in the inner fender well (BMC Mini?). Is there room here? Electric fan + duct makes lots of extra room.

Under the bed, spare tire area, pusher fans blowing down.

Two short radiators mounted at an angle would fit the area behind the grill and allow a few more inches of room in the middle for the crank snout and water pump pulley. Electric fans would probably be needed for that setup.
Jerry

I like the way you're thinking. My cousin and I pulled a 263 out of a 53 several years ago. I kept thinking of how much it looked like a Stovebolt. It would definitely be something different.

From my research, they aren't great when it comes to performance, but the cool factor is definitely there.

If I remember right, the 263 was barely longer than a 235, and the 320 is a couple inches longer yet.

As far as getting it between the firewall and radiator, I can't say what would need to be done. Where there is a will there is a way.

A section of a stamped steel wheelbarrow tub grafted into the center of the firewall can add a couple of inches or more of engine clearance without seriously compromising room in the cab, also.
Jerry

Total of bore pitches:
235: 21.3"
320: 29.4"
Total block length (estimating block is 50% of pitch before first and after last):
235: 25.5"
320: 33.5"

320 looks like 8.00" longer

How cool would four carburetors be, or dual quads? Bet it would be tough to setup though.

Get Mick53 involved and just build a blower motor...

Over on the Buick Club forums are a couple threads regarding
263s and the bigger 320s being run on today’s aftermarket fuel injection systems with great success.

Either a fabbed sheetmetal intake manifold or a rare 4 barrel (52 big series only) with adapter
Would work for FI.
Finding solid crack free exhaust manifolds is an issue. I believe somebody is making
Header flanges for Buick’s so you can have headers made.

These are great, torquey engines........ a Buick straight 8 was an NHRA record holder in
The D/Altered class in 1966.

DO IT......!

Thanks.

Hi Frank50

Well you have me "hooked" . My Dad was an ' International P/U guy ' (and, I have his last IH p/u after he passed back in the mid 70's - - - going on 43 years, now) (it sets in my yard today, but - I have it sitting on a mid 60's Chevy chassis with a
Chevy 250ci - 6, using the old power-glide ) .

So, before my Dad passed (I was still in High School, 1967) . . .At that time he was driving a 50 or 51 IH 1/2ton & we also had an old "burned-out Packard car" (like a 51 - 52 ) , with a good running 'flathead - 8' .

Well, he would not leave things alone, so - we did install that Flathead Packard straight eight into that old IH L-110 truck . And, it did set almost back to the truck bench seat. I can remember that he just made a "home-made fire wall cover" that you might
see installed in a Chev type Van of that time. It worked OK . . . but, you never had too use the truck 'heater' after that. Plus, I have been kinda looking for an OHV Buick straight-eight, myself , for some time now. I did have a friend give me a '53 V8
"nailhead" complete motor (really complete: with 'oil-bath & carb, exh manifolds, including the Buick 3-speed trans).

So, I say go ahead & go for-it . . . . you'll be the only one at "cruise-night" with anything even close . And, thanks for th' Memories - - - - jim

I found a 2 carb manifold for a Buick? a while back.

Ed

Ed - Buick offered a factory 2 x 2 set-up in 1941 and 1942. They actually used progressive linkage! Many (most?) were removed during WWII due to gas rationing.

For decades, we have been helping Buick owners replace the the primary/secondary carbs with two "normal" carbs for those that drive their cars. Smoother performance, and somewhat better fuel economy.

There are generally a couple of threads running at any time on the Buick section of the AACA forums. The Buick folks are pretty active.

As far as I am aware, this set-up is the only factory multiple carb set-up on an inline engine with progressive linkage.

Jon.

Didn't Hudson run a "Twin-H" carb setup that was progressive, back in the early 1950's?
Jerry

Nope- - - -just looked up a picture- - - -the Hudson has two carbs that are synchronized to open together! Some Nash OHV 6 engines ran a very similar setup in about the same time frame.
Jerry

Go for it! It would make the savvy people stop and look

And the LS boys shake their heads... I love it.

Year's ago I went down the same road thinking about a repowered straight 8 project. At one point I bought a Buick for the rebuilt motor and have had it stashed since. After riding around in a buddies roadster I decided someday I needed a roadster and since part of the reason I love the 8's is their looks my thought is to use it in that project. My plan is to build an AD truck roadster. I wanted to get the proportions right so I built a model. The straight 8 model motor was built by cutting two sixes in half so it's height isn't quite right but you get the idea. Last year while delivering parts to a body shop customer of mine I dug a very roached cab out of their scrap pile. After salvaging the only good couple pieces out of it that someone might need for patch panels I started cutting it down to the roadster body..
Someday I'll get back on this project.
Mongo

I understand your obsession because I want a Mopar flat 6. I could have had just about any Mopar sold but I am looking for the right one if there is such a thing.

Thanks for the encouragement.

Frank - I really think it would be a neat conversion.

However, if you do this, do your homework.

The Buick engine weighs about 135 pounds more than the Chevrolet.

Have no clue as to the weight of the Flxible transmissions you mentioned, but probably more, maybe much more than the Chevrolet.

So figure an extra 225 pounds on the front end, plus moving the moment of the weight forward.

The Chevrolet pickup is from the factory about 62/38 front to rear weight distribution.

Adding 225 pounds is going to take it above 65/35 percent.

I do not have sufficient engineering background in chassis design to know at what percent the vehicle becomes unstable in its steering.

Front shocks and front springs would probably need an upgrade, as would the cooling system (320 CID versus 235 CID).

And maybe larger brakes? Differential?

If you do it, please post pictures. I think most of us would love to see them.

Good luck with the project.

Jon.

I got into an engine swap the other way once- - - - -putting a small block 302 Ford engine into an early 70's 1/2 ton pickup that had been converted to a 460 big block engine. That one was way front-heavy and it handled lousy unless the bed was fully loaded, but it could pass anything on the road but a gas station. The owner was so happy with the swap back to the original engine that he gave me the 460!
Jerry

Thanks Jon. Those are important things to consider.

If I were doing it, I would cut the firewall and build a dog house to allow the engine/transmission to be moved to the rear far enough to be able to leave the radiator in the stock position. Nobody rides in the middle of the bench seat anyway. The front seat is narrow enough to reach the ole lady as well.

The tub of an inexpensive wheelbarrow can be trimmed to form a well-shaped firewall extension, and it saves a lot of fabrication time. The rounded contours are also more pleasing visually than some cobbled-up attempt at making something from flat sheet metal. The downside of that would be putting the shifter far enough back to make it necessary to get creative with shift linkage. An automatic trans would simplify matters considerably.
Jerry

I've been remembering long engines put in place of short ones that have come through the shop and the results were not sterling. There was a 1930 Plymouth 4 cyl with a 258 American Motors I6, a 1928 Chevy 4 cyl dump truck with a 216, and a WW2 Jeep with a twin cam 4.2 Jaguar I6. The Plymouth had been a taxi in Mexico and was a mess with a Rube Goldberg engine and transmission install, the dump truck was used in a gold mine and I wasn't about to ridicule the install because the driver used the back of the exhaust manifold as a gas pedal foot rest and had to be way tougher than me, and the Jeep/Jag project was beautiful but not good as a hunting vehicle for which it was intended; great cruiser. If you can do a sanitary install and keep in mind the weight/geometry changes Jon brought up you could have neat project. The exhaust sound of a Buick straight eight is in a class by itself. Good luck.

Then there's always those pulling rigs with Allison V-12's, sometimes more than one! Do you remember the "Elite Pete" that used to make exhibition runs at tractor pulls? Nothing like a longnose Peterbilt road tractor with a stretched hood and an Allison running on alcohol!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_rXaKxuqTk

Jerry

That’s awesome