The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Driveline My kingpin removal issue and fitment of new

Hi friends,
I have a 49 Chevy 3100 6 lug that sat in a farmers field for 45 years but is restorable despite that. I am removing the kingpins, I read many of the threads regarding this subject, however when I finally got everything off, including the lockpin and started banging on the kingpin, it went down about 1/8" to 3/16 BUT the bottom of the pin seems not to have dropped at all. I checked it's position before hand. Further pounding feels very solid. Not ever having done a kingpin removal before and had the removed pieces in my hands, I cannot understand this. The Yoke/spindle is very loose and rocks around the pin. Where is the friction/obstruction at? Where the pin goes through the axle? What about the bearing, how does that figure into it?

How will I know if I need to order an oversize pin?

The king pin was already down 1/8-3/16 before you started and you didn't see that? Maybe? and you haven't moved it at all? Zerk at top and bottom, lock pin in center? Right? Zerk holes, Zerk removed, would be a good place to apply penetration oil?
If it's a solid pin and you say it moved down, the bottom has to move also or it is 1) cosmic radiation thermal interpolation. Never seen on planet earth. 2) you bent/broke something, 3) you are wrong.
But I never worked on a AD king pin so 4) I could be wrong. Agreed, that is the least possible.

http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1948_51truck/51ctsm0302.htm

Isn't there something resembling a freeze plug in the spindle, top and bottom, that must be removed for access to the actual king pin? Also, have you removed the lock bolt (part # 13 in the diagram)? If so, any movement of the king pin can be monitored by watching the notch for the lock bolt move in relation to the hole.
Jerry

Just my two cents, FWIW. I have installed new pins and removed stuck pins in two front axles. Sometimes and with other truck projects I found it to be less abusive to just remove the axle and take it to the local machine shop. But that's just me. They have the large presses if needed, and machines and reamers to fit the new bronze bushings (bearings) , steel pins and they can address out of round axle ends or spindles too. I have never been disappointed with the results - a perfect snug fit and the cost wasn't that bad. As far as determining the size of the pins - whether .010 or 020 or other -they can measure. I usually order from the vendor ahead of time anyhow so the shop can use the measurement of the bushings and pins themselves and make adjustments.

If the pins don't come out easily stop swinging the big hammer risking bending your axle, and take the axle to a press. Or there is such thing as a "kingpin press" to take to the axle, but few have them.

For a how to on installing new pins and bushings, even oversize pins if needed, check out this thread.
Kingpin and bushing how to

I accept the sarcasm, its ok, Like I say, I haven't experienced having the parts in my hands and we males need "lab" as well as lectures. Damage to irreplaceable parts can total this truck and make it go from a potential daily driver to $9000.00 lawn art!

To Tom Moore: To The shop I go!

...and while that's being done - to the beer fridge you can go! I applaud the effort...good work!.

I remember doing these about three years ago, not that bad but just has time was your enemy seizing these little buggers, time is your friend too. First don't get in a hurry, remove the lubrication fittings top and bottom as well as the top and bottom stake plugs, then the lock pin.
Next, I took a propane torch and just warmed the joint a couple hundred degrees only, you can use one of those cheap temp gauges you get from harbor freight. Next squirt some Kroil penetrating oil into the lubrication fitting holes and lock pin void as well as the top and bottom of the king pin, give it a couple taps with a small ballpeen hammer/exercise the joint and say your most favorite chant or rain dance if you like. Then repeat the same the next day. On the third day, heat the upper and lower spindle housing joint and the ibeam to a couple hundred degrees, then with a suitable drift and hammer drive the king pin out. If all the planets are aligned and you did the rain dance right, you should hear a clap of thunder at that moment and the king pin will begin to move. Then repeat for the other side.

When I did my truck, I pounded them out and the axle bores got damaged. I had to have hardened steel bushings installed in the axle to bring them back to standard. With my 38 Master, I already had purchased a 30 Ton press and that did the job rather well. One of them still took quite a bit of force before it gave. I would always use a press now.

Agree ^^^^^^^^^^^^ two options beat them with hammer ( BFH) or press ( on or off the vehicle)............press wins every time.

Sometimes however they do slide out with a punch and small hammer, so worth trying that before removing the entire axle, unless you want the axle out for other reasons.

I replaced the kingpins on my 54 last summer. They were the originals. I beat and pounded with no luck. I finally dropped the axle and once I had access I tried knocking them out with 12 pound sledge. No luck. I took it to a machine shop/ He even said with his press they didn't want to come out. The guy even cleaned up the axle for me. Well worth it. he charged $150 to give you a reference.

Thanks for your additional replies. Yesterday I called around to the local and not so local auto machine shops and found out they do not do "push work". So I went to harbor Freight and brought their 8 ton press, modified it a bit for the size of the kingpin, have a proper setup and am resigned to the patient process of pressure, repetitive careful heating, penetrating oil and time. I am going to get a gallon of penetrating oil and soak the joint. Last night, after a careful heating cycle, I did hear a pop!

Hopefully it is true from what I have read on other threads, this axel does not require oversize bushings/reaming unless they are worn. According to the machine shops, that is $80.00 per joint. $80 here and $80 there adds up to big money fast, which is the basic story of these restorations.

I replaced a set in a 69 ford F-100 once. Like you after trying to beat them into submission heat became my friend. then they came out with ease. I heated them up after soaking in penetrating oil then let them cool a bit before hammering. Then I just replaced the brass bushings and all was good again.

Good Luck

RK

That HF press will come in handy for other things as you know - and it will pay for itself in part by helping to remove your king pins. At the least, that's how I justify tool purchases. For 180.00 their 20 ton press has come in handy for pulling and installing spring bushings, pinion bearings, straightening bent linkages and more. Once this task is completed you should feel a good sense of accomplishment. Another thought is Kroil. I have used other brands of penetrating oils but that seems to be the stuff that has worked more efficiently for me. Not saying I am pushing this product but it seems to be the most aggressive. I quit counting receipts for these projects awhile ago. I would rather be at bliss and ignorant justifying a small shop and tools purchased along the way with correctly completed projects. Tool purchases fit well into my retirement investment plan too.

Feel the same way Tom, I purchased my 20 ton press about 1/2 way through the restoration, at least I have it for the future. Done a number of jobs for friends too now. I get satisfaction doing things for people that they otherwise couldn't have done for themselves unless they opened their wallet and paid somebody to do it.

I've learned that sometimes a hand sledge works best if I just forget what it is and swing it like it was a dead blow hammer with slower and more methodical swing-through. Especially for things like kingpins, using a dead blow type swing often can get me more success than setting it down and smacking it as hard as I can. And even things like rock work...splitting rocks for example...this approach seems to yield cleaner cuts with less chips and doesn't mushroom the end of the chisel nearly as much. Just a suggestion.

Good luck with the press.

If I were to use the sledge approach again, I would pound from the top until it started to move a tiny bit. Then I would change the setup and drive them out the top. In my case I think the initial pounding to get them moving, increasing the kingpin diameter slightly. then when I drove them out it damaged the bores.

Thanks for the additional replies/encouragement all.

Jon G: Very good point.

Update:
Since I could not find a shop to press out the kingpins, I purchased a harbor freight six ton press and pushed the pins out myself. One pin I pushed out from bottom to top. It was slow going with multiple heat thaw cycles and only a 1/4 inch progress each "pop", if that. The other pin I pushed out from top to bottom and it went well, no heat, popping a few times but then pushing out as fast as I pumped the jack.
I believe what what was holding the pin from moving was the inner race of the bearing was rusted to the kingpin. For whatever it is worth, making a simple press with a bottle jack is preferable than banging it out which I tried for a while and found exhausting and discouraging despite being a Big Guy and of positive disposition.

One reply on this thread suggested making a press using a bottle jack out of square tubing and 3/4" all thread. At tractor Supply I noticed, after I brought the Harbor freight press, that they have 3/4 all thread and in the towing section nice, stout square tubing for $20 each that could be used to make a press. Harbor freight might also have the square tubes in their towing section.

Best regards to all and thanks for the observations and moral support!

I have a kingpin spindle reamer for 1941-52 Chevy truck - if you need to borrow it let me know.