So I just picked up new inner and outer front fenders for my 53 one ton. I was told "they are already primed, ready to paint". Is this for real? I thought they were painted to keep them from rusting during shipping, but I'm not sure I would trust that paint as a good primer.
Anyone have experience with this? Or advice? (Or both)?
Tim
I am currently digging back in to a 1953 3800 (one ton) with a nine foot bed. I've owned it since 1979, and drove it until 1982 (or so). My wife got me involved in restoring it back in 2002, got the body removed and the frame redone, then things came up. Now I am retired and starting again. If anyone is interested I have photos on Imagur ( https://timwhiteblues.imgur.com/ ). I live way back in the woods in the Ozarks on 40 acres at the end of a 2 1/2 mile private road.
Most "new" quality sheet metal has an E coat, Electrocoating. In the EPD family. This can be scuffed, cleaned and painted over. Some sheet metal can have what's called a cheap "transport coat" applied. It can be black and look like E coat. This type should be removed and primered.
It must be noted that there are OEM sheet metal parts that have real good Ecoat. There are aftermarket, off shore, sheet metal parts with questionable "Ecoat" or unknown coat. (our parts) This is where you get: "sand it, remove it, seal it, scuff it, hate it, love it" comments. They are mixing apples and oranges. Obviously since you only have one truck and are not a quick turn around body shop, you would be safest by removing it. Whatever it is. You will never know until it's too late.
On another related subject, you should not paint activated paint over rattle can primer. Lots of folks use rattle can primer because it's easy and protects until paint time. But it probably is not compatible with real automotive paint.
My plan so far is to scuff the coating (whatever it is), cover it with two coats of red oxide primer, then paint it with the enamel I got from Jim Carter, which is not an activated paint. That is what I have done with the cab, and it looks pretty good (so far).
Maybe I would be better off stripping these fenders down to bare metal though.
Tim
I am currently digging back in to a 1953 3800 (one ton) with a nine foot bed. I've owned it since 1979, and drove it until 1982 (or so). My wife got me involved in restoring it back in 2002, got the body removed and the frame redone, then things came up. Now I am retired and starting again. If anyone is interested I have photos on Imagur ( https://timwhiteblues.imgur.com/ ). I live way back in the woods in the Ozarks on 40 acres at the end of a 2 1/2 mile private road.
Well, I got the fenders (two inner, one outer) out of the packaging, and found:
The outer fender has a really smooth, sort of glossy black coating One of the inner fenders has the same coating The other ineer fender has what looks like a coat of gray primer.
Not idea what any of it is. I guess I'll sand off what I can and paint the bare metal. Some places I wound be able to completely remove the coating (where there are multiple folds making a curve), and I have no access to sand blasting.
Wish me luck!
Tim
I am currently digging back in to a 1953 3800 (one ton) with a nine foot bed. I've owned it since 1979, and drove it until 1982 (or so). My wife got me involved in restoring it back in 2002, got the body removed and the frame redone, then things came up. Now I am retired and starting again. If anyone is interested I have photos on Imagur ( https://timwhiteblues.imgur.com/ ). I live way back in the woods in the Ozarks on 40 acres at the end of a 2 1/2 mile private road.
When I owned a body shop and my reputation rode with every job that went out the door, I didn't trust primer, paint or sheet metal work that wasn't done by me of one of my employees. If you're willing to blindly trust an unknown prime coating, let's play some high stakes poker- - - - -You'll probably draw to an inside straight! Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
I faced a similar problem several years ago with my ‘46 project. The PO had reportedly taught paint and body work at a votec. The truck was worked on by his students. The body work was reported by his widow to have been mostly completed and the sheet metal primed. I was thinking some sanding and new primer coat would make it an easy and fast completion. Some of the guys here cautioned me to not trust the quality of the previous work. Reluctantly I followed their wisdom. They were absolutely correct! The previous work was a testimony to the art of plastic sculpture. That plastic junk was discovered to be almost an inch thick in places when the body shop took everything down to bare metal. Sheet metal patches in some places were riveted in place and plastered over. Really glad I listened to the guys here.
One of my mentors liked to use "Bondo Remover"- - - - -ever heard of it? Instead of sanding the stuff off and creating choking clouds of dust, just warm up the back of the panel where the plastic filler is applied with a torch flame and use a putty knife to scrape it off in big thick chunks! A good coat of primer and a little sanding can hide a multitude of sins! Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
I faced a similar problem several years ago with my ‘46 project. The PO had reportedly taught paint and body work at a votec. The truck was worked on by his students. The body work was reported by his widow to have been mostly completed and the sheet metal primed. I was thinking some sanding and new primer coat would make it an easy and fast completion. Some of the guys here cautioned me to not trust the quality of the previous work. Reluctantly I followed their wisdom. They were absolutely correct! The previous work was a testimony to the art of plastic sculpture. That plastic junk was discovered to be almost an inch thick in places when the body shop took everything down to bare metal. Sheet metal patches in some places were riveted in place and plastered over. Really glad I listened to the guys here.
I metal finished my first Model A hot rod, while a friend did his in bondo with at least an inch thick in the roof. Mine took 8 years, his about two. He showed his for years alongside mine until he passed away. Our two trucks looked the similar, no one knew the difference and I swear he won lots more trophies than I did. Sure, taking all that stuff out makes you feel better, I guess...
99.9% of the time a coat of epoxy primer will seal anything and protect the rest of the paint job. That does leaves 0.1% possibility that it won't. "You gotta ask yourself one question. Do you feel lucky?, well do you, punk?"
99.9% of the time a coat of epoxy primer will seal anything and protect the rest of the paint job. That does leaves 0.1% possibility that it won't. "You gotta ask yourself one question. Do you feel lucky?, well do you, punk?"
I have gotten lost in trying to follow this discussion.
Epoxy primer is an excellent first/sealing coat over clean/bare/"washed" metal.
Is epoxy primer the question, or is EDP the question?
Since the sheet metal we're dealing with is either 60-something years old, or new stuff that comes from unknown places and might have whatever "paint" that might be handy at the time on it, Applying more primer and/or finish paint over that unknown layer on top of the metal underneath means exhibiting a degree of faith in the bond it has to the metal underneath is a risk I was never willing to take. "Your mileage may vary!" Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
The discussion is to answer Bluesman's question about unknown coatings on parts he bought. Some are odd looking, not black. I mentioned Ecoat/EDP to him. Epoxy has been mentioned by several of us. This discussion naturally has to include EDP and a suggested primers/methods in order to fill-in the poster. Not meant to confuse.
Many so called experts do epoxy over edp. Many owners say their new parts were edp and then epoxy and then the usual paint job, After many years it's still OK. Painting, and all that goes with it, has a 100 opinions and products. Just saying that roughing the edp and priming with epoxy has history. Epoxy can work over anything. Not known to react. If it's roughed sanded and cleaned, it seals. It's EPOXY!
Eastwood website quote: "Existing Finishes: Epoxy primer is perfect for paint jobs over existing lacquer or enamel finishes. The epoxy primer will create a barrier to keep topcoats from reacting to your old paint. Sand existing finish with 180 - 440 Grit and shoot 2-3 coats of epoxy to seal away the old finish.
"Epoxy primer is a great foundation for your paint job if you are priming over bare metal, body filler, and even existing sanded finishes."
The 1% I mentioned, as a guess, is for possible off shore Micky Mouse "Primer/EDP look-a-like". But epoxy will probably seal that too. IF prepared correctly. We all agree that bare metal is safe. So DA away if you want to.
EDP is better than any primer for adhesion to bare, if correctly done. New autos are all done with it. It is electrodeposited. Cross between a primer and a plating. Super good. If its real, it does NOT need removed. What we are warning about is that it may not be real. If it's hard to get off with a DA and doesn't flake, it's real.
I have always wanted to ask Bluesman why he didn't ask the vendor, that told him it's OK, what the coating is and from what country. Also tell us where he bought each piece.
I once stripped off the edp of a fender and found a finger print of rust forming under it.. I felt like a lucky punk that day I tell ya.
Maybe you could send a photo of that finger print to China and get the guy fired for shoddy workmanship.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
