The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop getting oil to the top of my 54' 235

I have oil pumping to the bypass filter. The oil tube from the rear of the block up through the head is open and the valve train is clear. I ran air through it. I couldn't get air to go "backwards" into the opening from the cam bearings. So I intend it pull off the pan and look from the bottom. What an I looking for?

Is the engine out of the truck on a stand or still installed? Fresh rebuild or well worn?
How much oil pressure is the engine making?
Solid or hdraulic lifters?
Is the bypass oil filter plumbed correctly,?
If not it can rob most of the engines oil pressure. You might try plugging it off and testing. Don't bypass it, plug it off at where pressurized oil leaves the block and feeds to it (usually where the oil pressure gauge line connects).

Reason I ask is that I recently rebuilt a 54 235 and as you have determined the oil to the valve train goes through the rear cam bearing. On a new rebuild one needs to be careful when installing the rear cam bearing. It can be pressed in too far blocking oil passages or the bearing hole not aligned in the block. The rear cam "freeze plug can also be driven in to far which could also block oil passages.

If your engine is well worn in the above cam bearing/freeze plug suggestions won't apply and I'd then suspect crud in the oil pump feed to the block or passages in the block.

Good luck
Dave

Taking the pan off will not assist you here. You will not get air to go through the rear cam bearing. So there are a couple of things you can try here. If you can, get yourself a spare distributor. Grind the pin off the gear, remove the gear, then remove all of the guts except the shaft and housing. Bring your motor up to TDC for No. 1. Remove the distributor. Disconnect the steel line behind the side cover at the top. Install your newly made tool, making sure the tang on the shaft engages the slot on the oil pump. Chuck an electric drill to it and spin the oil pump. You should get oil out of the top of the steel tube. If no, disconnect the bottom part of the tube and repeat. If no oil out of the rear cam bearing boss, then either the cam bearing was installed improperly or the wrong bearing was used, or maybe some junk in the main galley clogged it up. If you do get oil out of the top of the steel line, conncet it to the head. Spin it again. You should get oil to the rockers. If not, the passage in the head is clogged and needs to be cleaned out.

Here is the rub. It is possible to get the motor started and running without the tang on the end of the distributor engaging the oil pump. So, you will have to confirm that you got the tang into the oil pump slot when it was installed. That very well may be the issue, no oil pressure at all.

If the distributor tang is engaged to the pump and still no oil at all, then you will have to go to plan B.

Plan B, either install a T at the back of the block and run a small diameter copper line from the T, around the back of the head and along the pass side of the head to where there is a little hex plug on the side of the head. Install the appropriate fittings and plug the line into the head for oiling to the rockers. The aftermarket used to sell kits for this purpose (clogged steel line) and they turn up on ebay every once in a while. As noted above, bigger is not better here. To large an id on the line will bleed all the pressure and starve the motor (main and rod bearings for example).

Plan B.1, Run the copper line from the out put of the oil filter to the side of the head. The oil filter just dumps the oil directly into the pan anyhow where it is instantly diluted with dirty oil. Now you will have clean oil to the rockers. Just make sure you don't have too much oil to the rockers. Again, more is not better. The rockers should not be spitting oil out. They should be dribbling. Dribbling oil to the rocker tip and push rod cup, and over the spring to cool it. If spitting, its spitting onto the inside of the valve cover and not lubricating like it should.

My vote, Plan C, take the motor apart and see what the culprit is and fix it.

You're looking at a full teardown if you can't get airflow through the rear cam bearing. No shortcuts are possible. There is a large-diameter oil gallery that's drilled through the lifter bores front to rear on blocks set up for hydraulic lifters, and something is blocking that passageway, most likely. Another option that would not require removing the engine would be to swap to a solid lifter cam and the appropriate lifters, but I'd still be spooked by the lack of proper oil flow. Since this is a brand new engine, just bite the bullet and do a complete disassembly to correct the machine shop mistakes.
Jerry

The engine in a stripped chassis.
1954 according to block #s
Shows no sign of ever being rebuilt.
Solid lifters.
The filter is lined correct. I don't see any thing that looks like a restriction fitting,but I think it's been as is since removed decades ago.
The oil fills the filter vessel completely when the engine is turned over. ( I had the distributor 180 out at first and turned it for some time)
I bought the motor from an old knowledgeable fella I trust. He bought it at an auction decades ago and never put it to use. He did turn it from time to time and it was inside. It was a complete running engine according to the shop that was closing. I'm into it for $150

It's replacing a 216 in 40 truck.
I'll pick up an oil guage tomorrow, don't know the pressure.
I started it, ran it for a minute, checked some things. Then ran it for another minute or so, with no coolant, just enough to warm the head a little.
It had a whining noise so I pulled the valve cover and it didn't seem to be getting much oil. I call a local old school pro and he made it seem that oil should squirt past or beyond the head it anything over a high idle.

So, can air be forced past the rear cam bearing? If so where's it going and how do I tell?
I peeked in at the timing gear through the return hole and it seemed dry to me so with a funnel I gave it a little drink of oil.
Should I restart it once I have the pressure guage on it?
I have the 216 distributor. Is it the same "enough " to fit the pump to drive it?
800 rpm on a drill should get me 12-15? 35-45 at speed?

I had it on a stand pulled the pan, cleaned everything up, oil pump screen ect. Looked over the cylinder walls, crank and it looked real good.

I've seen people in the past run motors that have sat for a while on oil cut with various things to thin it on first start up. Good - bad idea?
I'm sure there is no obstructions from the rear supply above the cam through the rocker train.

Thanks for all the help. Sorry for being vague at first. I was rushed.

Solid lifters? what kind did you use? Milk bottle style with full sides or the later type with the cast relief in the middle? No don't use the 216 distributor. It has a slightly different design then the later distributors. Use one that would otherwise be installed in your block to create the correct oil event. The delco remy unit ending in 2403 became the service replacement for all early distributors (directly from delco remy literature) so I would not take a chance. They can be had for 20-30 bucks on ebay or I will bet close or better then that in the classified here.

I would not start it until you have sorted out the oil issue

Small up date.
You can force air backwards through the fitting above the rear cam bearing.
I attached a hose to it and to compressed air (100 psi) and could hear it bubbling in the pan.
I have the spark off and the plugs out. It took a bit for the pump to prime perhaps but oil cam up into the clear hose.
I realized I needed to release the compressed air nozzle so the oil could flow after the first attempt.
So..... I'll call it a small victory for today.

Thanks for all replies

Quit running the engine until you discover what's going on. Just remove the distributor and use a piece of 1/2" steel round stock with a screwdriver shaped tang ground into the end to spin the oil pump with a drill motor. Watch the oil flow and figure out where the restriction is.
Jerry

If I find time I'll make the tool today and pick up a gauge.
How can I ensure the timing gear and front cam bearing are getting oil?
I'll have a bunch of foolish annoying questions for everyone in the future.

I picked up a set of gauges and ran the motor.
The oil pressure is 45 psi. More than expected,
Could that be a red flag?
I'm still not sure I'm getting enough oil to the top end.
I may be over reacting, but no oil weeps to the valve stem end of the rockers.
It seems like gravity and an up hill situation to me looking at the shape of the rockers.
I'm considering cutting the lubricant to flush to motor. Thoughts ?
I'm seeing oil return at the tube in the top end but not much from the rockers.
The engine whine is gone. I figure it was the timing chain.
I think I should pull the dizzy, spin the oil pump on thin lube and see what happens.

Did you accidentally press the "Hotrod Lincoln Mute Button"?
He is trying to spoon feed you some very important information to prevent you from creating a boat anchor.
In your exuberance to get this engine operating right, you are skipping some very crucial steps.
Stop running the engine as he has suggested.

If there is even the slightest amount of oil showing up at the small holes at the top/center of all of your rocker arms at idle, you are in Great shape. More comes out at higher RPM and everything gets oil a as needed. Your "local old school pro" is mistaken about how much oil is delivered to the rockers in these engines. Maybe his school wasn't built until after 1963.

You can confirm how much oil is reaching the rockers with the 1/2" round stock tool Hotrod suggested. Use a 1/2' plug-in-the-wall drill so that you have enough torque to get the oil moving and keep moving once the pressure builds up.

There is no easy way to check oil to the timing gears without tearing the engine apart. We generally find that out the hard way. If the harmonic balancer seal is leaking at the timing cover, you are getting oil to the timing gears. Who says all engine leaks are bad?
Carl

Any opinions are appreciated

Carl, I'm accustomed to getting ignored- - - -I've been married for 41 years this time around!

Jerry

Thanks Carl, that's helpful.
I intend to make the tool Hotrod Lincoln suggested and settle my concerns.
I currently have a nasty sty in my eye so I'm holding off on grinding any metal for a few days.
Actually, the engine sounds really good!