The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The Electrical Bay What do I need to start?

I have the '52 6400 loosened up and it has not been started since 1996. Rats ate the wiring and I have replaced the plug wires, plugs,etc. I know I need the wiring from battery to starter and 12v to the coil and wire from coil to points. What else do I need to see if it will start?

Nothing else except ground from battery to motor.

Thanks. If it isn't raining tomorrow, I may see if it starts.

What are you using for fuel supply? I would recommend against using the gas tank after sitting 21 years. The last thing you want to do is introduce a pile of crud into everything downstream of the fuel tank. I would borrow a small plastic fuel tank used for small outboard motors. The primer bulb comes in real handy to get fuel to the pump in a hurry.

Definitely do NOT use old gas!!! Feel free to ask my why.

I have a 1 gallon tank I use for this stuff. Not my first time, but thanks for the reminder. I haven't done it on a vehicle where all the wire had been eaten in a long time. Stuff got crazy, so I hope to start it Thursday or Friday.

I put a half oz of Marvel's in each cylinder and ran it around to make sure everything was lubed. Hooked up an oil pressure gauge to make sure I had pressure. But then the throttle was seized up. Trying to free it up, I broke one of the screws in the throttle plate. I went to the parts swap meet yesterday and think I found a part to fix it. I also made a contact who lives near who thinks he may have a whole carb if I want to just replace it. Hopefully this week I can get the carb fixed and get the thing started.

I tried to start it last night but there was no oil pressure. Do I need to prime the oil pump first? If so, how do I do that? If not any ideas on why no pressure? I have verified the gauge works.

Lets get the facts first. Did it fire at all? Did it run? If you are looking for oil pressure from just the starter, you may not see much. Did you put oil on the valve train? Where did you put the gauge?

The oil pump is usually primed with dizzy off and a suitable rod that fits the pump shaft, down the hole where the dizzy was, and driven by a drill.

What motor? What does "ran it around" mean?

It did not fire up, but I have checked and I have spark. So it did not run.I put oil on the valve train, in the filter canister, and in the oil pan. I put marvel's mystery oil in the cylinders twice to get everything lubed up. bartamos, I don't know what you mean by [quote=bartamos]

I am unfamiliar with the term dizzy (distributor?) and I never said anything about "ran it around". The motor is a 235 in a 1952 6400 2-ton.

"I put a half oz of Marvel's in each cylinder and ran it around to make sure everything was lubed. "

rotated the crankshaft?

Well, if you have mystery oil in the cylinders, it's too wet to fire. Take out all spark plugs, put a little gas in plug holes and turn it over with starter till all blows out. BE SURE you take center wire off distributor. Don't want any spark while cleaning out. Air dry with air pressure and then get it firing. Don't worry about oil pressure until she starts. Let it run 10 seconds, read pressure and shut off.

Dizzy= distributor.

The distributor shaft has a shape at the end that mates with the oil pump drive shaft. So to run the oil pump, you have to have a long "rod" or old screw driver shaft or whatever will be long enough to reach down and mate with the pump and stick out on top to chuck into a drill so you can spin the pump shaft. That may not be necessary. I say lets get it running first. (for a few seconds). However, if you feel better by priming, then take out dizzy, take out plugs, take off dizzy wire and drive pump clock wise and observe gauge. You need a good strong big amp drill.

So what does ran it around mean? Turned over with starter? by hand? push/pulled the truck? Started it up?

One can also dump a small amount of fuel in the carb to see if it briefly fires on that small amount of fuel.

Ed

I guess I did say ran it around. I manually turned the crack to lube the rings with the Marvel's. A friend just called and he is coming over Saturday with a tool to prime the oil pump. He said we needed to do this because the '52 has "babbit heads"? and they get screwed up bad without oil. The truck has been sitting for 20 years, so I guess that makes sense. The carb leaks like crazy. I am just trying to get it to fire off to see if it is worth keeping. As a teacher, I don't have the cash to replace it anyway. I ordered a rebuild kit for the Rochester carb and maybe that will be all it takes. It seems to me that I wouldn't get much oil pressure until it starts anyway, but he insisted we need to make sure it will have pressure. He is a Ford guy, so it may be different for them. I wanted to verify if it is a babbit engine, but I can't find any numbers on it anywhere except on the head, so I don't know what block it has. It is supposed to be a 235. I believe in '52 all the truck engines were babbitt, but I'm no expert and obviously the motor could have been changed. With no numbers anywhere, I don't know how to sort it out.

Head numbers were 3836848 and then B52 I think an "8"48 850.

You have no numbers on the flat boss just to the left of the distributor?🛠

you might want to ID your engine

Here are locations for codes on 2 different generations of stovebolt engines.

Post the head and block casting codes and the head and block date casting codes and the engine serial number.

http://www.1954advance-design.com/Web%20images/casting-code-photos/low-press-codes-ser-nums.html
http://www.1954advance-design.com/Web%20images/casting-code-photos/codes-ser-nums.html

Never heard of babbit heads. The motor has babbit bearings. The idea to prime is OK except the Ford guy. Other than that, a good plan. It will take a long time for oil to appear in upper part of motor. There is a valve that has to open with pressure. The pickup screen could be blocked. Gauge has to be placed in correct location. There is no "high" pressure. So on a 100 lb donor gauge, it won't move much. Need a gauge with 30 lb max. I.E., small increments

Here is a post from Jerry. Before spending money, pay heed to his last sentence.

"A 1952 235 will be a low oil pressure "splash oiler" engine, the one with Babbit bearings built into the connecting rods. It's an upsized version of the 216 that was originally used in medium-duty trucks and military vehicles from 1941 to 1953 or so. It's an interesting engine, but old geezers like me who remember how to work on them are getting few and far between. Virtually nothing on the early 235 interchanges with the later model engines with the insert bearings. Speed equipment- - - - -forget about it! Even the camshaft and crankshaft is different than the later engine, and the pistons are made of cast iron, not aluminum.

If you're building a numbers-correct restored show truck, stay with the early engine. For practical purposes and ease of repair, go for the 54-up later design 235.
Jerry"

The Rochester could be leaking because of old gaskets, stuck needle valve or sunk float. Kit will fix that..........OR they leak due to warped bottom and tops. Not an easy fix. More gaskets/thicker gasket will add to the problem. Lay the gasketed surfaces on glass or marble counter top and test for flat. No space between glass and casting and no rocking. If warped, skip the kit and reconnoiter.

"A Ford and his money are soon parted."

I all ways put an ign. resister in the wire going to the coil when using 12 volts. You will burn the points other wise.

I have the resistor, There is no numbers to the left of the distributor on the flat spot and I used wrong terminology by saying babbitt heads. I guess babbitt refers to bearings. There is an oil feed to the top pf the block above the distributor like a low pressure should have, but someone has pinched off the hose. I don't know why they would do that.

Have you tested the plugs since oiling the cylinders? I have ruined an entire set of plugs that way.

You do not have a '52 235. A 3836848 head will only fit on '53 and later full oil pressure 235s.
There is a date casting on the block above/behind the starter.
I will bet a donut to a dollar (inflation has caused the juxtaposition of nouns in that metaphor) that you do not have an oil distributor on the driver's side of the engine, which means that you have a full pressure 235 and not a babbit bearing engine.
Carl

It started today, but wouldn't keep going. My Ford guy said the carb needed rebuilt and then it should run fine. Parts on order, waiting to get started. Still can't ID engine, but I was told it cannot be babbitt because it has an oil pump. Does anyone know anything about this?

I think a babbit has an oil pump. Carl has said it's a full pressure, non babbit.

Oldie, there are numbers cast into the side of your engine block. Get you a scraper and a big light and find them. They ARE there. If you don't have numbers on the flat boss beside the distributor, you may have a factory replacement block the dealer didn't stamp. Or, someone ground off the numbers of a stolen engine. Find the block casting numbers and we can tell you what you've got. I repeat... THEY ARE THERE!🛠

I think I found the casting code between the distributor and the tube on the right.It is hard to see, but I think the number is 3769716. Inliners.com says that is a 1960-61 235 engine. Still can't find a serial number or date code, but I will keep looking.

Yahoo, you found it. I knew you could do it. Now you know what you've got.

The B52 date code on an "848" head designates February 5 1962.

The block date casting code location is shown in a post above and it will ID the year of that high-pressure 1958-1962 235 block (3769716).

What is the latest status on this project?

FYI, I did remove several posts that were off topic. Thank you for your understanding.

My mechanic had to cancel last night, we were planning to start it and make it RUN today. But I will rebuild the carb this week while it is raining every day and hopefully we can get it going next week end. But since he said it appears to be all good, I ordered and received a basic wiring harness, so I can get started on that soon after getting it to run. I also expect to get the wheels and tires in the next few weeks, so I better get on with a brake job.