The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The Electrical Bay New wiring questions

I am in the middle of replacing the wiring on my 1950 3600. The previous owner had it wired in such a way as to make it run, with no concern for anything else.

Currently, he had a wire running from IGN on ignition switch to one side of the ignitor ballast, and the other side of the ballast running to the hot side of the coil. Then a wire running from neg side of coil to distributor. My new harness does not show how to run the wiring to an ignitor ballast. So now would I run the positive coil wire to the ignitor, and add a wire to go from ignitor to pos coil? And then there is no neg coil wire on my harness so should I just add that also?

Sorry if this doesn't make sense, I'm new to all this and learning as I go...

Sounds like the original owner had that part right.

Run a wire from IGN on the switch to one side of the ballast resistor.

Run a wire from the the other side of the ballast resistor to the + on the coil.

Assumeing you have a stomp start, run a wire from the + on the coil to the small terminal post on the starter switch that's on top of the starter motor. This wire back feeds the coil with full battery voltage when the engine is started.

Run a wire from the - on the coil to the distrubutor. The points are grounded and when they open and close they complete the circuit, no other ground wire is needed in this circuit.

Hope this helps,

Mike B

Mike,

Thank you for this, it's very helpful. Out of curiosity, why didn't any of these wires come on the new harness I purchased? Thank you!

If you have a ballast resistor, you have a 12v system. Your truck was originally a 6v system (needing no ballast resistor). Someone converted your electrical system from 6v to 12v.

A stock '50 didn't have a ballast resistor or the starter button direct connection. The repro harness is for a direct stock replacement.

Mike,

http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/...8-4223-A580-5484353A6D9C_zpswcvk48ax.png

Based on this picture, which post would I run that wore to get a full 12v on startup? Thank you sir,

You do not have a foot operated starter switch so the quoted advice won't apply in your case.

dx3,

You have an electric solinoid on your starter.

S = starter switch

R = Coil +

Mike B

If your solenoid has terminals marked "R" "S" "B"(or batt), the big red cable I see should be from the battery to the big post. As stated, the "R" goes to coil +, the "S" goes to the ignition switch marked "SOL". Now back to your ballast resistor question. You need a wire from the "IGN" terminal on the ignition switch to the ballast, then out the other side of ballast to the coil +. That would make two wires to coil +. First, follow all of those wires on the solenoid and draw a schematic diagram and study and see if it matches the info here. Solenoid may be marked "I" instead of "R". Same hook up.
The ignition switch is usually marked on the back. Batt(B), on/run(IGN), Acc, Start(S) or similar markings.

In your case: The full 12V is applied when your spring loaded switch is held far right or your push button is pushed. When either is released, the run circuit, thru the ballast, takes over. Mike and TC have already said all this, hope I did not add confusion trying to capsulize.

Mike was saying "assuming you have a stomp starter". Now we know you don't, now we know you have 12V. We don't know what Ignition switch you have and assume you still have a voltage reg and generator.

It's best not to use electrical tape like we all used to. Now we have tie wraps and loom. Electrical tape will not last in that heat and is messy to get off. If it was used to mend, that's no good. The wire should be totally replaced.
If you wish to use duct tape, contact 52Carl. (expert)

DX3: This is why posting in more than one post about the same thing is not a good idea. If you have an alternator, please disregard my wiring info, or at least as it pertains to voltage reg and such. Seems like you have a one wire alt and you said "no points" in the other post.

http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/...B-4659-AA68-8D2B2EB629C7_zpsrkur9adj.jpg

My distributor

http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/...4-437E-831A-E805A60711BC_zpsm9mrli8c.jpg

My schematic I drew.

So I have a purple "starter ignition switch start" wire and a pink "coil positive" wire.

The way it was previously wired I had 4 wires going to my starter solenoid. Battery, alternator and 2 other wires that came from the ignition switch. I have the battery cable and the alternator hooked up to the same terminal on the starter solenoid.

I've read responses over and over, and for the most part they make sense, except for not really understanding how/if these wires pass through the start solenoid first? The only letter I see on the starter solenoid is the S, the post the alt/battery is going to I don't see a letter signifying which post that is.

Thank you gentlemen for being patient with me.

Here is your drawing/schematic re-oriented

You might want to show where wires connect at each end.

I'm sure the solenoid is marked "R". If you see another stud other than the big battery post or the "S" or the permanent attachment from starter to solenoid, it's "R". We can't deal in colors, just what hooks to what. Use whatever color you want or have. I believe you have the alt correct to same spot as batt plus on big solenoid post. Hook it all up as my post says (no voltage regulator hookup at all). Unless someone states otherwise.
As TC indicates a schematic needs to have everything hooked up as you see it. I realize one side of ballast was not terminated. Get a new externally resisted coil and a new ballast resistor.
RE: Your comment of understanding, but "do the wires go thru solenoid first". The ignition switch/button has a hot wire to it and "switches" that hot to the necessary functions, like energize the solenoid and send power to coil, etc. Just hook up wires as stated. The ignition can also power other components. Refer to a schematic for your truck and the harness schematic, while keeping in mind you have a few modern upgrades like alt and electric solenoid. Once you draw it, and display it, we will give you the OK to wire it and start it, if that's what you want. There is no one schematic for ign/start/run now that you have converted to 12V and added upgrades. You/we have to "piece" them together.

As I suggested: Follow all wires, all wires regarding ignition/start. Show how the ignition switch and/or push button is wired, how the starter and solenoid is wired and draw a complete diagram, turn it to read straight and post it. Forget mentioning colors, just circuits/hook ups. (Put them in the drawing if you want.)
We are with you, you are doing very well, stay on this post, do the work and keep checking the post and answering questions regularly.

The ignition/start/run are kind of direct wired as seen in my hookup recommendations. The other functions like heater fan, lighter, E-wiper, etc., generally are feed thru a fuse box. Hot wire from ignition to fuse box (one side of fuses for all the items I just mentioned) then out the other side of fuses to each component's switch, in and out of the switches to fan or lighter or wiper, etc. Again I'm speaking generally in green, just to give you a basic idea of what you are doing. The headlight switch is also a source for power to the lights including dash lights and dome. The new harness will wire these after you get the non-harness ignition/start/run hooked up.
You do have points as you know. no problem.
PLEASE state what kind of ignition switch you have, spring loaded, so called V8 switch? or original type with push button mounted somewhere??? or post pics.

Bartamos,

Thank you for taking the time to reply with such detailed responses. They are greatly appreciated. Here is a picture of my ignition switch

http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/...B-468B-B9C5-CCC0A22B2A3A_zpsaszzbxwr.jpg

I try to do most of the reading on my phone in between calls at work so sometimes it gets difficult to understand what you are saying. Hopefully I can make it to a real computer screen soon to make better sense of what you're telling me. Thank you again,
Jonny

I think you are real close. Take your time.

I feel like I take one step forward and 3 steps back! But thank you for your patience. 2 darn wires!!!

In tracing my 2 wires I'm unsure about, I found the ignition wire starts at the start terminal on the ignition switch.

The positive coil wire runs from fuse box.

With this in mind, is this enough information to answer my original question? I was going to draw a schematic, but figured with 2 wires it might be just as easy to explain. Thanks again for your patience.

OK, lets forget your original question, lets forget tracing and lets forget your new harness for now. Lets get the start/run portion wired. This is done with just wires. NOT YOUR HARNESS. Use new wire or extra new harness wires. Using the markings I see on back of ignition switch and marking on solenoid, Install wires as follows:

1. From the center terminal on Ign Sw to "S" on solenoid.
2. From Batt terminal on Ign Sw to your battery pos post. This wire needs a fusible link installed on the battery end. This wire can be crimped to that extra smaller wire on battery cables. This wire is not the battery cable, that is no. 7.
3. From Ign terminal on Ign Sw to ballast resistor (mounted on fire wall)
4. From other side of ballast resistor to coil pos.
5. From "R" on solenoid to coil pos.
6. From coil neg to distributor side terminal.
7. Battery cable from battery pos post to starter big post. (you have a cable there already it seems)
8. You will do the Ign Sw "ACC" terminal later.
9. Wire alternator per internet or whatever instructions you have.
10. NO other wires to these terminals above for now.
11. Wire as above, no fuse box involved, no other way, no PO wires.
12. Use crimp-on ring tongue terminals with shrink sleeving. Route wire neatly and away from exhaust and sharp edges. Tie wrap every 8" and loom. Clamp where necessary. Use proper grommets thru firewall.
13. Use any colors that make you happy. Different colors are nicer to trace than the same colors.

Study tips on Stovebolt or consult the web for proper gauge size to use for these wires.
I would rip out old wires from these places and put in new. If you think you can get this wired per above, with the old wires staying, that's up to you. I would buy a new external resisted coil and a new ballast. I have said this before. Please advise if you are doing that. Let us know when motor starts up.

This way you don't have you ask about any PO or strange wires. If you wire per above and have extra wires somewhere, RIP THEM OUT AND THROW THEM AWAY.

Fusible links sold at O'Reilly's. Buy a size, four sizes smaller than the wire it is protecting. I.E. protecting a 8 AWG...use a 12AWG fusible link.

Bartamos,

Thank you sir for your continued responses, they are much appreciated. I'm confused as to why I'd bypass my brand new harness I just bought to run my own wiring? The whole point of buying the new harness was so I had good wiring that was correct.

All of the old wiring in the entire truck, aside from the 2 wires on the starter solenoid have been removed. A new ballast resistor has been purchased and will be installed once I work out which wires run through it. What would be the benefit of buying a new coil as opposed to the one I currently have installed in the truck? Please understand I'm asking these questions because I don't understand, I am not questioning what you have said.

Thank you again,
Jonny

Coil: If old coil works, no problem. I just remember seeing a worn out tired coil in some pic.
Harness usage: The answer I've tried to relay is that the few wires we are doing right now and in my post above may not be part of your harness. I can't deal with the colors and the questions regarding your harness as it relates to the few ignition wires. Just as long as you have wires hooked up the way I describe for start/run, it does not matter if you want to call it a harness or use your harness or use some wires off a spool. I can not answer questions about your harness or what wires are already hooked up. So I decided to approach it in a simple way. Simple steps. Most of your harness is for lights, accessories, gauges, horn, turn sigs and so on. After you get these few wires hooked up per above, we WILL use your harness for the rest of the truck. A harness is 99% wires coming out of a fuse box and going all over. The wires above, in my post, DO NOT, therefore I DO NOT consider them part of the harness. As I've said, forget the harness for now. If there are wires that you see that can be used from the harness, use them.

What harness brand and Part No. did you buy?

Harnesses are broken up into branches and there are several smaller harnesses within a kit sometimes. If you want, we can call these wires "ignition harness." As said earlier, your harness may be built for a stock truck, your ignition and your charging system are not stock and therefore some auxiliary wiring needs to be done. That's what we are doing now.
As you can see, the confusion you have is caused by you not understanding the harness that you bought and PO wiring. You say you bought it to do your own wiring. That is what you are doing with the start/run part. Move forward please.

http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/...7-45CD-ABDB-66E9A8BF6006_zps5nojlde9.jpg

Is the thing the pos battery cable going to supposed to be the coil? Or what is that?

Bart - as always thank you for your time in responding and as soon as I can get to a computer I will respond to everything you said.

Why do I get the feeling I'm being pimped? Like you say in your profile occupation "Not Telling".
If you answer my question in the last post, I will answer yours.

But here is a hint regarding your question about the Battery Pos cable:
Hook up ignition/start like I said above, in post 1117238.

I am shutting down now until you tell me you have the ignition/start/run wired per 1117238. You don't need a computer to do that. You don't need your harness. You don't need to respond to anything else. You do need to reduce your MTBF.
Good luck.
Patient Bartamos has left the building.

Have enjoyed this exchange, which raises a question in my mind

What is proper name for that little length of wire often spliced in before the ignition switch; the purpose of which is to act like a fuse (ie. go up in flames/disintegrate in event of a major short circuit)?

Fusible link. A safety devise, as you say, that will fail under extreme conditions. A fuse, in certain high amp places, will not handle a spike. They will blow all the time. See bottom of post 1117238.

Bless you