The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot '60-'66 Trucks Intermittent horn

Hi. I am working on my 63 Chevy pickup horn. All new harnesses, horn contact, upper steering bearing, etc. Everything live up to the button. Horn only beeps sometimes. Any ideas? I've troubleshot for hours/days. It's like something is just not making a good contact. I even took steering wheel off again and backed out upper bearing thinking contact spring was not hitting it enough. Even put back in some of the old parts to test. It's not the harnesses or anything electrical. Something with some contact not being solid. Anyone ever had something like this and figured it out? Had a 66 Plymouth Sport Fury when I was a kid that did this and end dup giving up and just putting a toggle switch on the dash. ready to give in with this and do that and then it will beep again.

Not the expert, but the experts always say, check for ground. Welcome to the pages. Hb

Thanks for the help. Yes, I did all that. I can basically stick a screwdriver on the contacts at the horn and it will blast away, then I used a wire to trace all the way. I got a new under dash harness and a new turn signal harness. New horn relay. Electric is live all the way through those and when I run a test wire from the upper steering bushing, which is new, that is active. When I put together the steering wheel and horn contact spring and the metal cup it will beep intermittently. All of the brass on the steering wheel is clean. The only other thing I can think of is if somehow the steering wheel itself or the brass on it is warped slightly which I can't detect with just my eyes. It's a mystery. Sometimes when I push the horn cap it will beep and then nothing. Horn cap is good, rubber is good, plastic 3 screw ring is good. Then sometimes I turn the steering wheel slightly and it will beep and then nothing again. I'm ordering another horn contact spring on the odd chance that the new one I got is faulty but they are pretty simple so I don't know what could be wrong with it. Anyway, again, thanks for the suggestions. If I do figure it out I'll post my remedy in case anyone else runs into this. Still open to more suggestions.

OK, will check that again. Thanks.

Went through it all again. Still doing the same thing. Is there another horn ground besides the wires going into the horn relay? Every time I run a test wire from the upper steering bushing and ground it to a bolt on the dash it beeps without any interruption. Horn cap seems to work fine. I put it all together and it beeps once or twice then as soon as I turn the steering wheel or start to drive it's done beeping.

To be sure to back to lugnutz comment. Scrape to bare metal where the bracket mates with radiator bracket. Then make sure radiator bracket is grounded to frame. And while at it ground in a few more places. Still no expert and my horn is not working yet, but I am tracking with all of your troubleshooting.

You have a good ground then still intermittent horn points to the horn button parts are bad, bent, worn out.

Thanks. All parts are new except the steering wheel. I ordered another horn spring contact in case the new on I got is bad. Nothing looks warped on the steering wheel to my eye but I'm going to try to devise some sort of test rod to puit in where the horn contact spring goes and turn the wheel to see if it's making contact all the way around. Anyway, enough said. I'll just have to keep trouble shooting it. If I do figure it outI'll post my findings to hep anyone else with the problem.

I know on autos made late 60's the directional switch harness also carried the horn circuit. And the directional canceling cam had the horn contact ring built on top of that.

Now if your truck is like that as the steering wheel gets turned or shift levers move they could cause a slight movement of that harness. And if that harness is bad it can then make the horn intermittent.

Thanks again. Yeah, something is up. That harness is new and I also just went to put in today a new dash cluster harness. I don't know if the company I'm getting them from make them wonky or I have some major short or grounding problem in my truck? I had a few glitches I thought I'd fix by shelling out the bucks for new wiring to make the truck better and it seems like it has only opened pandoras box. Put on the new dash cluster harness and now my parking lights won't go out unless I disconnect it. Gauges don't register anymore either Old harness worked fine but had to jiggle it to get dash lights to come on so I thought I'd replace it. Now I have 5 problems.

Ok, here is my thoughts (disclaimer, I have a 64 so there may be some differences):
For the horn, was there a custom steering wheel/horn for 63 and do you have one. If so it may be the hardware holding the horn in place. On these there is a plastic ring that contacts the concave metal flex plate. Without that it will never work (been there done that). If it is not a custom steering wheel/horn I would still start at the concave metal flex plate. If this thing is not shaped properly it will impact how the horn grounds when you press the horn button. Make sure that when you install the three screws/plastic spacer the concave metal flex plate is still free to move. Also, it should be installed with the dome up.
For your dash lights and gauges, get your schematic out and a probe with a light in it to verify voltage. Activate each switch and confirm you have voltage (the light goes on) both going into the connector and at the back of the dash. You may have to pull the dash out a bit to get some clearance.
One thing you can try for the dash lights is to replace the light switch. I know this doesn't seem to fit but I had a situation once where the high beams worked but no low beams, turned out the internals of the light switch were worn out. And check because you may be able to get one from O'Reilly's or similar without spending a lot or waiting for shipping.

Thank you Rusty64. I've been wondering if it may have something to do with the flex plate. Mine has a horn button retainer cup that sits on top of that and it does have the plastic ring. All of that is intact. I've tried screwing it in tight or loose to see if it affects it. Same thing. Does for a minute then stops. I have been trying to find a diagram of how to hook the wires to the horn relay under the hood. I bought a new one of those and am hoping I didn't hook the wires up wrong but I tried switching their position and it didn't seem to do anything. Do you happen to know the pattern for hookup on that? The issues with the electric I will continue to trouble shoot. I have a new tail light harness on the way so I'm hoping that will resolve the issue. Strange because my old dash harness seems to work fine. But sometimes I find something new doesn't like something old on these things so once I install the new tail light harness, if that doest correct the problem I'll just put my old one back on until I figure it out. Thank you for the suggestions. I am going to try all of what you said. I may just try to order a new flex plate for the horn online somewhere. Maybe someone replaced it at some point with the wrong one? Mine is grayish or silver, looks like tin. Wondering if brass would be a better contact? Some of the ones I saw online look like they are brass. Any thoughts? Does it have to be a specific size? Mine looks like it fits.

Do you have a picture of your installation? I will try to take some pics this weekend of my relay hookup.
I don't think you want a brass flex plate. If you have a place near, I would suggest just getting one from a salvage yard. The other good thing about that is if you can take it apart yourself you can confirm that you are installing yours correctly.
Another thing about your wiring - Make sure that you have a shop manual. It will have the schematic and you can use that for reference.
Also, you may want to stop installing new parts until you get what you have working. You don't want to just keep adding problems as pretty soon you could end up with multiple things wrong and the more that is wrong the harder it is to isolate the problem because you could fix one problem but because something else is wrong you don't know that you fixed part of the problem.
On these old trucks you have to have a good ground and you have to ring out each wire individually to make sure each one is good.

See if this helps.
http://s307.photobucket.com/user/Rusty_1964/media/P1010161_zpszvl3ub8f.jpg.html

Thanks again. What is that photo; for the horn relay hookups? If so, which wire is what? I'm still working on it. Crazy stuff happening so I'm putting in new ground straps and will try the new tail light harness I got to see if that solves anything by competing some circuit that may be shorted. Will post any positive results.

FWIW You might try....

running a temporary dedicated ground from the battery negative terminal to the horn. Run it that way for a while and see if that fixes the issue.

If that doesn't work try the dedicated temporary ground attached to the steering column.

I had a similar issues with my 65. I restored the column (bearings, bonnets, and turn signal switch) and used a different steering wheel and the problem went away.



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John

Thank you. I'm going to try that and post my results when I do. On the temporary ground to the horn, do I attach it directly to the horn? On mine there is only one wire directly to the horn, the other goes to the relay. On your second option, where would I connect it to the steering column? Thanks.

Don't mean to steal the agenda, but a question for Hot Rod John might help at some point.

Can I check the horn relay on the bench with hot lead and ground? Correct procedure if wrong, but all I need to do is listen for the relay to switch? Can you describe the correct method?

Took everything apart again, pulled the steering wheel, put it back together again, put in another new horn contact button, checked with test wire. Even put in my old horn relay in case the new one was faulty. Horn honks away once I put everything back. Then, once I slightly turn the steering wheel either direction it's all over. Nothing. Sometimes if I re-center the steering wheel it will beep again. Seems like it has to be in one perfect spot for it to beep. Makes no sense to me. Only other guess I have is turn signal cancel cam on back of steering wheel but I replaced that. Neither that, nor brass on interior of steering wheel, look warped or anything that I can see. Maybe something in the steering column itself causing it to ride high once it's turned keeping the contact from touching the upper steering bushing. Hate to spring for a new column and wheel just to find out it still doesn't work. May just have to put in a toggle switch for now. I still welcome any other ideas.

In reading you state a new harness so all the wires in the column are new, no chance for a insulation scrape that is making intermittent contact.

I found one time the three part rubber/plastic isolator was not holding things quite right so I added three plastic washers (from lowes or HD) on the column side of them to add just a wee bit more spacing.

I checked for insulation scrapes or crimps of any sort. None that I see. By the isolator, do you mean the plastic, three screw, ring that screws on top of the brass horn button retainer cup? Did you put the plastic washers around the screws and between the brass cup and the plastic ring or...? Thanks.

When I worked as a mechanic I had seen quite a few cars where the wiring going up the column was bad. When the steering wheel would turn it would cause directional to not work and fuses to blow.

Drove my 1965 C10 last night first time since connecting the horn after a rewire. My horn blows intermittently too, usually when turning the wheel for "parking lot" turns. I'm hoping to discover the problem too.

Uh oh. Hope I didn't start a bad trend. I still haven't figured mine out. Going to poke around the steering column to see if something is out of alignment somehow. Please let me know if you figure anything out.

Never did figure it out. Put a $3 toggle switch under the dash by the steering column. Works just fine. Switch on the horn when I need it.