The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Paint and Body Shop Stopping Rust in Seams?

Has anybody come up with a good way to keep
the rust from creeping back out of seams, like the crease around the rear of AD cabs,
or around door opening seams where the panels
overlap? I took the hood off my car and cleaned the seam up around the hood, wasn't
hardly 2 years till you could see rust bubbles starting along the seam again. I wondered if I cleaned it up and maybe tried
seam sealing it? I don't want the same thing
happening on my truck when I paint it. :confused:

One of the tricks we suggest for just such problem areas while you have things torn apart, is to thin some bulk Zero Rust, pour it into the affected area and let it "seep" into all the cracks and crevices, pouring off the excess into a catch basin for reuse. Thinning helps put our paint's solids in contact with the steel that it wouldn't otherwise make contact with in the more concentrated form.
Seams, pinch welds and the like are always a DIYer's nightmare, but with a little work, you can at least get some rust inhibitor on that steel to gain rust protection, then use your seam sealer.
HTH
WK Irish

Thanks, I'll have to check into Zero-Rust. Are there and dealers of your product in SW Pennsylvania?

Whitelightning:
No, which is one of the reasons for our website's mail order system.
Whilst checking us out, be sure to read John Milliman's product review right 'cheer on your stovebolt site for his comments.
WK Irish

Ok, I have a zero rust question. My truck was sandblasted and primed. It is still pretty rough and a bit of rust is starting to show through the lousy primer. This has hurried along my plan to paint the truck.

So, I am planning to sand down to no rust and do some body filler myself. Then I will take it down to Earl Sheib who will put on several coats of cheap paint. I would like to have the truck primered/sealed properly but it would add too much cost to use the proper epoxy primer as I have talked to several shops.

The thinned zero rusted seeped into the joints post made me think. Even after sanding things down there will be pits in the metal that probably still have some rust in it. Short of putting a solid coat of zero rust on this, what if I thinned the product and wiped it on these areas with a rag or sponge? I could do several applications.

This wouldnt affect the surface very much and would be easily sanded prior to the cheapo Sheib paints, but, it would fill in a lot of the pitting with the solids from the zero rust? It should also give me some additional working time while it protects my bare metal before going to the paint shop?

Questions. Would such a treatment, after sanding be compatible with regular paints? Does this sound like a good idea at all?

Since my inside fenders were blasted and primed too I will put a solid coat of zero rust there. But, I am thinking a brushed on coat of zero rust on the exterior would add a lot of sanding work, and the rubbed might be easier and maybe more effective getting into the small pits?

Too bad you could not have spent the bucks for an epoxy primer on the outside. My question is why do you have so much rusty pitting left after blasting?
As far as the backs of those panels are concerned ZR away. Seal up those surfaces. Understand the Zero Rust would have worked better without the junk primer between it and the steel.
On the outside question, If you were going to put ZR over everything first, the proper approach would be to leave that film alone and build your sandable system over that. This is done for 2 reasons. #1 ZR desn't sand for sour owl feathers and #2 you want to leave the ZR film intact to provide the seal. Earl scheib is not going to stand behind any issues concerning compatability between what ever is on the rig when you bring it in and what they will apply. If anything lifts, the warranty is written on the head of this pin and they wrote really big......

Sounds like they painted your truck with lacquar primer. You may have more rust there than is showing yet. Lacquar primer isn't waterproof, moisture, rain just go right through it. It's not much better than having the truck sitting in bare metal.
Sounds like you have right idea on stripping off old primer.

Ok, the compatibility issue has me worried. Sheib uses a two part polyurethane.

So, this is my dilemma. The truck is showing very little rust and it is just barely starting again. I think it needs a really good sanding. Then it has some minor ripples that needs a little filling. All that I can handle np. I was hoping to be able to add some extra rust protection before putting on the latex sheib paints. But it sounds like I should just do that and take it in, totally depending on their paints for protection. It sounds like there is not much I can add myself to improve the situation unless anybody has ideas?

Taking the truck to a seperate shop for a spray of epoxy primer would more than double the $350 price of the paint job.

Is Sheib going to put a sealer coat on over primer before they shoot finish coat of paint? If not you might see if they offer that service or what would be compatible with their top coat.
You really should have a sealer coat over the primer. Are they using a water-based paint? I noticed you said latex. I didn't think poly was a water-based paint. I know Calif. has stricter rules on pollution (VOC) of paint products and was advicating the use of water-based paints.
Do you have a garage you are working on this truck in? I don't know what your long term goals are for the truck, but I can tell you a cheap way to paint it. You won't have the shine, and the paint will weather faster if you keep it outside. If you keep it polished the shine will last longer. You can use Rust-O-leum Primer and a top coat of their paint product. The only thing is that in the future if you decide to paint with an automotive paint you'll have to strip the Rust-O-Leum paint off, it's not compatible to spray automotive finishes over it. I buy the quarts or gallon and thin it about 30% to spray with a regular paint gun. It spray like enamel paint, tacks off in about 4-6 hrs, can top coat in 24 hr. Wait about 15-20 minutes between coats of primer or coats of color. I'll probably catch heck on here for even mentioning this idea.

Sheib puts on a base coat but it sounds like it doesn't do much good as a sealer. I believe the website said their paints are latex which I think does mean water base. They are two part Polyurethane with or without clear coat.

Still, with my own preperation, rattle can primer on the bare spots and a solid coat of Sheib the truck should be fairly well protected no? I will paint the insides of the fenders with zerorust as well.

Most rattle can primer is lacquer based, so when you get the body work done keep the truck out of the rain and in a dry place or you'll probably have rust showing again.
Thats the big problem is knowing what is compatible with their paint. The lacquer primer should be compatible.
Do you have a spray gun? I seen on another posting that you were going to buy some airtools, you might look at a siphon paint gun, seems like even the cheaper guns don't do to bad for primer/sealer type coatings.

I just wanted to claify one thing from above. Once you get Shieb to paint truck then it will be weather proof, but while you are waiting to get it done keep truck out of rain and in dry place.

Thanks for all your help. In fact, I was looking at some cheap sprayers today. I figure it will be sanded so all I care about is applying some material.

So, fear of compatibility is the problem. So, I should just stick to laquer primer? Could I spray some of the heavier surfacing primer with such a gun? A couple of coats of that stuff all sanded down would sure make the job look nice.

Tony M,
It's hard to say what primers are compatible for spraying under Shieb's top coat. I've never had much problem putting any kind of paint over lacquer.
They make a primer/surfacer in lacquer that should be no problem for you to spray.You will also have to have lacquer thinner for it. It thins at 100 to 150 % to the paint, plus you'll need it to wash out your gun. I clean my gun by first dumping out any excess paint in another container, then I usually wash out the cup and the underside of the top of the gun. I keep a coffee can to pour my dirty thinner in. Then I put some thinner in the gun a open the adjustment up on it and spray the lacquer thinner thru the gun. After you have sprayed some thinner thru the gun, take a rag and hold it over the cap tightly and spray the gun. After you are done with this, remove the cap and make sure it is clean in the cap, make sure holes thru cap are clean. If not wash cap out in lacquer thinner till it is. Replace cap and wash out cup and any places that any paint still may remain. I use a small 1" paint brush to wash gun with.
Have you talk to Shieb about what would be compatible with their product. When I worked in a bodyshop we used a two part acid primer which was mixed 50/50. This etched the metal and layed down a thin primer film, didn't fill anything thou. It dried in about 1/2 hr, then we used a primer/surfacer that was a 3 part mix. It was used to fill minor imperfections and scratches. We sanded this then it was ready for base coat/clearcoat or acrylic enamel with hardener.
If you use the lacquer it would be a good idea to use a metal prep on any bare metal you have, it helps remove minor rust in pits or scratches and etches the metal to make the paint stick better. I hope some of this helps.

Hi...I just got my 65 Chev pickup out of the body shop...looks factory new. New wood bed...however the shop had the truck in there for a year...got tired waiting so i pick it up...and the gingerbread stuff ...like under coating to be done later.

Since i had the truck though...have notice a rust crack on about 4 inches long on the floor near the passager door on the hinge side.

The shop owner says he would cut it out and patch so new metal in and then spray the under fenders and chasis with something...tary is my guess.

I told him that i was concern about whether the floor of the truck holding the bench seat was sturdy enough as i noticed one of the seat bolts had a 2x2 shim underside with the bolt comming though it like a washer with a nut.Was concern that this might have been done a the floor may be weaken with rust.

He told me that the floor was ok and didn't need anymore re-inforcement...as i was thinking a sheet of plywood under the seat then cover with carpet.

What are your thoughts about this???

Another question...under the fenders...hood...and engine compartment...i was think of just brushing or spraying rustolium on. Is there a better or proper substance to be used? Such as the zero stuff mention in the above posts???

I plan to keep this truck as it was my late father's.

Thanks!

Starrider null

Starrider88,
It's hard to say about condition of floor. The rust along the floor on your truck is probably localized. It hard to say for sure without being able to see it. If your cab mounts are still solid on this truck, I would say that the floor is too.
As far as undersides of your hood, fenders and so on, it hard to say which product is best. It really depends on what you want to top coat it with. I've used Rust-O-leum on my inner fenders then I like to use a brush on type of undercoating. Seem to last much better than spray can undercoating. One tip I'll pass along it is better to use the Rust-O-leum in the pints/quarts than the spray cans, seems to give a lot better results. Rust-O-leum can't be used under regular automotive paints thou.
As far as Zero-Rust, I,ve never used it myself so I can't say how well it works. They have a website with all sorts of info on their product, www.zerorust.com .
If you have rust on your undersides of fenders and decide to use Rust-O-leum, I like to add just a bit of a product called Penitrol (spelling may be off), it an additive that makes the paint smooth out better and if you have pitted rust you can put it on in a wet coat, let dry overnite then prime with Rust-O-leum. Seem to work on rust real well.

Whitelightning and guys...i agree that painting rustolium on is better than spray can...as you will get more of it on with the brush.

I think that is probably how i will go... with rustolium.

On another note...back to your original theme "rusting at the seams" there is as i decribed a rusted through spot on the right floor pan.

Actually it looks like a four inch snake crack that is under the right door slid strip...nearest the hinge side of the door.

I don't think the whole floor pan needs replacement... and too costly...but i like some input on how it should be properly cut and patch. The rusted crack is about one 1/8"wide at the most and 4-5 inches long. If one wasn't going to keep the truck they could just fill it up with JB weld epoxy and bondo on the topside and undercoat the bottom...but that is the wrong way.

The bodyman says he would patch it but i just want to make sure that he doesn't cut any corners.

Your input appreciated

Starrider

The only reason I say that the Rust-O-Leum in the can is better is because it is still enamel, the stuff in the spray can is ??. The spray can says you can topcoat in 15-20 minutes. The quarts/gallon take 24 hrs before top coating. I,ve just had much better results with the stuff in the can. It dries to a harder finish and seem much more rust resistant than spray can.
I not real familar with a '65, but if you can have him butt weld the new patch in (no over lap). That's one thing I've learned from my car. I had it fixed around the quarters and painted. Last fall I patched up the quarter on it ( they were busting out around the wheel lip) and most of the worst places were where they had welded the patch over the old metal. If it is somewhere where it is not feasible to cutout and butt weld and they have to overlap the metal, have them clean the place up free of rust (grinder, sandblast or other method) and use a weld throught primer on both the patch and the metal they're welding it over. Then make sure its sealed good both sides after repair.Hope this helps.

If you have a spray gun and want to spray Rust-O-Leum all you have to do is thin it 33% or 1 part mineral spirits to 3 parts paint. I usually save metal cans from soup ect.. and use a wooden stick marked at 1" for paint mark and 5/16" mark above it for thinner. I usually mix it then allow to stand 10 minutes or so and mix again, then pour it through a paint filter.

Whitelightning...i will probably use the brush with the rustolium under the hood and and under the chasis rather than a tar like undercoating...butt welding ok!

Thanks!

Starrider