The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop problem today - '51 3100 dies on me

I finally got my heater back together and in, and the wipers running (sort of), and took the truck to get it inspected for licensing today. Got up to the shop and had forgotten the paperwork, so I hopped back in and headed home to get them. About a half mile into the trip back to the house, on the downhill on-ramp to the county highway, the truck died. When I realized it wasn't running, I stepped on the clutch, then popped it, and it started again for a few seconds, then died again. I pulled over and tried a few more times, and it had plenty of crank, but wouldn't start. I had it's 5 year old battery out the other day and charged it up, so it's on its way south, I guess. But it was more like it wasn't getting fuel. I did have the lights on, and there was a hiss coming from the wiper motor area. Tomorrow, my first step will be checking the fuel filter (don't know how old it is), because this truck has sat for awhile on flat land, but now is parked down hill at my house. I've driven it on short drives lately, but that's it. After I check the filter, I'll see if there's gas at the carb. Since the truck was changed from 6v to 12v by the previous owner, I'm just wondering if there's anything that I need to check that might be related to that, or if anyone has any thoughts on this if it's not a fuel related problem. Thanks for any help on this. Lee
Also- it never did start. The battery started to drag after 5 or 6 tries, and I called AAA to carry it home. Looking at it tomorrow.

It doesn't take much juice to keep the engine running - if it had plenty of crank, it had plenty to fire the plugs. So I don't think that's it.

The "hiss" is an attention-getter, but I think it's a red herring: Do you mean while it was still running fine, and the wipers were on, you heard the hiss? If the hiss is heard with the wipers off, then it's a vacuum-leak. BUT, the line to the wipers is small, and I'm not certain it would kill the engine like that. Definitely cause a rough, poor idle, and maybe since you were on a down-ramp with your foot off the gas, it died at idle. Anyway, it should be checked - be sure the vacuum line didn't fall off or suffer a melt-down. If you think it's a potential problem, for the immediate situation, plug the line - maybe crimp the hose close to the source, just to be sure it's out of the equation.

Checking fuel is a good first stop. A plugged fuel filter I wouldn't think would kill it cold turkey - usually, it leans out the fuel, and the engine sputters, or it will die, but start up again. But, definitely worth checking for fuel at the carb.

Stock engine? Original 216, I think? Or upgraded 235?

Take the air filter off and look down the throat of the carb while you operate the throttle briskly. See if there's a squirt of fuel in the throat of the carb. If not, it could be the fuel bowl is empty, ie: not getting fuel. Are you certain your gas gauge works, and you're not out of gas?

While you're there, double-check that the choke and mechanism is operating correctly, and that it hasn't flipped closed.

Once you're confident it's getting fuel, it's time to start checking spark.

Others smarter than me will chime in - post back with your findings.

-Michael

Fuel, spark and compression.
1) pull the air cleaner and manually open the throttle fully while looking down the throat, you should see a good squirt of fuel. If not troubleshoot the fuel system.

2)check for spark @ #1 plug. (I have a cheap spark tester but a phillips screw driver will work or just pull the plug, plug the wire back to it, make sure the metal part of the plug is grounded, turn key on and if you still have the stomp starter, manually engage the starter or have someone do it for you, check for spark. If no spark troubleshoot the ign system.

3) if #'s 1 & 2 pass, makes sire the timing is good and test each cylinders compression. If one or more cyls are low pull the valve cover and troubleshoot accordingly.

Those are quick easy checks that should narrow your problem down to the individual subsystem. Makes it easier to find and repair.
Good luck
Dave

While you were under the dashboard with the heater and wipers, you may have disturbed some wires. They are old and may have some bad connections. I had this happen to me and a wire on the ignition switch had come off. So i would check under the dash for a loose wire.

Check for fuel first. Possibly plug the vacuum line at the manifold, temporarily, fix that later. If you have no fuel to the carb, check to see if there is fuel to the pump. Disconnect the line and see if if runs out. From wht you have said, this sounds like the old junk in the fuel tank problem, closing off the tank outlet. If you were low on fuel, the pump could suck the junk into the system and cut off the flow. Sometimes after sitting the fuel will start to flow again, only to clog when the pump starts. A short burst of air could blow the clog back into the tank and allow a very short term fix.

I agree with MikeE. Had the same problem with various old vehicles over the past 55 years or so. If they set for any length of time you gotta clean out the tank, lines and filters and usually the carb. Good luck.

Thanks, everybody! I just found this post was moved, and for some reason the email alert isn't working, so I haven't been checking back. It poured here ALL day yesterday, so I'm getting back out there today. Will follow all these ideas, though Tommy's idea hit me as a possible. I had my arms up in there messing with the wipers and just scouting around. Could have done something there. But it seems to me like it might be a fuel problem, although I will say it's got a brand new tank and lines, and the pump looks new. Also has what looks like a newer filter, but the guy who owned it before me didn't drive it much. But I did drive it 5 o6 miles before my trip into town to the inspection station. I've also got to finish wiring from my heater switch to the blower today, and I'm putting on a heavier ground cable, since it's now 12v and the old cable looks pretty tiny. And, btw, it's a '57 235 with 5000 on a professional rebuild, with most of the major parts being new. I still have to ask a few questions on the electrical side. I'm not sure what is what, (generator, etc.). Also, I read something in the manual about some systems being ground positive, so I hope I didn't screw up and put the cables on backwards after I charged the battery the other day. Thanks, fellas! I really appreciate the help.

Just some random thoughts: The "hiss" sound...do you have vacuum wipers? If so remove the line from the manifold and cap it. One thing out of the way. Is your fuel filter clear so you can see into it? If it is and it is clean, then you might have a blockage at the tank. Not too hard to pull the flex line from the tank, watch out fuel will come out. If it does not, then you are empty, or, plugged. Start with the simple stuff. Check one thing at a time. I have had the fuel line plug. Stops, try's to go and is done. I have had the fuel pump fail. No gas no go. That can be checked at the filter if it is between the pump and carb. just take the line off. Put a can under it and crank a bit. Fuel in the can? Pump is fine. No fuel? Pump is bad. GMC had a positive ground. Chevy did not. Pop the cap off the dizzy. Do the points open and close when you turn the motor by hand? Good. They don't? Reset the gap. Now for some old school tricks. Use a match book cover. Put it between the points. Turn on the key and measure the volts at the + side of the coil. 6 volts if the truck is still 6 volts. Around 9 if it has been converted to 12 volts. turn the key off. If you don't have 6 or 9 volts you have a bad wire to the coil(6 volt) or a bad ballast resistor(12 volt). Got volts? With the key off turn the motor with the match book cover out. Let the points close. Put the match book cover back in. Turn the key on. Put the volt meter back on the coil(+) and pull the match book cover out. Volts should drop to 0. Volts stay? Bad points. Volts drop? Points good. With a running engine, you now have spark and fuel. It had compression. You did not break any thing, it would have made some expensive sound for sure. Now, you have fuel, spark and compression it should run. I hope this helps. Let us know what you find.