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Fixing the old truck

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Joined: Mar 2007
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Crusty Old Sarge
Crusty Old Sarge
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Phil, I just wanted to thank you for your posts. I lost my 17 year old Grandson in October. I haven't really been able to get to a point where I was ready to work on the Truck again, although I know He would have wanted me to finish it. I will get back to at some point.. Reading about you and your grandson does help in that process. Thank you.


~ Craig
1958 Viking 4400
"The Book of Thor"
Read the story in the DITY
1960 Chevrolet C10
"A Family Heirloom"
Follow the story in the DITY Gallery
'59 Apache 31, 327 V8 (0.030 over), Muncie M20 4 Speed, GM 10 Bolt Rear... long term project (30 years and counting)

Come Bleed or Blister, something has got to give!!! | Living life in the SLOW lane
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Craig, My sincere condolences. It’s always disheartening to hear about the loss of loved ones, especially at such a young age. I'm sure your grandson would want you to go on and finish your truck. When the time is right, you’ll know it and it will feel right.




Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
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7/14/19: Today I discovered a puddle under the engine which lead straight to the water pump. One of the thru bolts that tighten the pump to the relocation plate was weeping. I tried to tighten to no avail. Long story short, I disassembled from the radiator down to the pump and realized that the thru bolts were not sealed. I looked at the instructions and there was no mention of sealing these bolts. It has a direct leak path from the coolant jacket in the block right thru the pump. The plate appeared to be adhered to the pump so I pulled the affected bolts, added silicone to the plate and bolts and reinstalled the fan, belt and radiator. This time I reversed the bolts so the heads were in the water jacket and the nuts were outside. My logic was that it would only have one leak path, under that head of the bolt vs. two, under the nut and thru the threads. I want to wait to add the antifreeze until the silicone is fully cured for 24 hours

I started fixing the hood latch plate where a PO cut and bent back the top edge to allow more clearance for the radiator. Now that the radiator is in its original position, I wanted to fix the the PO’s sins. Finally I was actually getting to do some bodywork, a passion I’ve had since High School. Not being a scholarly student, I elected to go to a tech school for autobody. I spent half a day in tech school and the other half taking the minimum classes that enabled me to get my high school diploma. As career, it didn’t work out, but that’s another story.

I picked up a a piece of railroad track at an estate sale recently and found it perfect for reforming the edge back to the the way it was from the factory. This was the first time that I welded thin sheet steel with a MIG welder, and it went awesome. Forty years ago, the common practice in autobody was to do lap joints and braze the panels on, and that was the technique that I learned. Following advise I found on YouTube and this forum, I used tiny tack welds, spreading them out so the heat would dissipate before returning to that spot. A few try’s at getting the heat and feed settings set and I was off to the races. It was much easier than I thought. After grinding down the welds and a bit of planishing, I applied a light coat of plastic. A bit of sanding, a coat of prime, a bit of Satin Black paint and she was ready to reinstall.

Attachments
95B1070D-2501-4615-8321-19445CB37B26.jpeg (256.58 KB, 452 downloads)
130B2227-6B03-4455-A436-9A737E789A55.jpeg (202.03 KB, 455 downloads)
CC696057-0516-4313-87C4-0DD51D1708DF.jpeg (219.25 KB, 452 downloads)
3B3A51EB-F2E9-4821-A474-036220E48D32.jpeg (201.08 KB, 452 downloads)
F86E1EF5-FBCD-4F03-A902-700E5CDA0B14.jpeg (192.69 KB, 444 downloads)

Last edited by Phak1; 01/16/2020 2:03 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Crusty Old Sarge
Crusty Old Sarge
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Just like it never happened, great work.


~ Craig
1958 Viking 4400
"The Book of Thor"
Read the story in the DITY
1960 Chevrolet C10
"A Family Heirloom"
Follow the story in the DITY Gallery
'59 Apache 31, 327 V8 (0.030 over), Muncie M20 4 Speed, GM 10 Bolt Rear... long term project (30 years and counting)

Come Bleed or Blister, something has got to give!!! | Living life in the SLOW lane
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
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7/15/19: Today, I finished the job of resealing the water pump by adding antifreeze. Prior to her first “Road Trip”, I want to check the fluid levels in the rear and transmission. I’ve had an issue removing the plug on the rear end, because it is worn, rounded and I can’t keep a wrench on it. I took my die grinder and sharpened the flats so it would retain the wrench better. That did the trick as I was able to remove the plug. Once removed, I further filed the plug in a vice to give me a nice square. I topped off the rear end with 90 weight oil and reinstalled the plug.

While I was filling the rear end, I saw that there was a puddle under the engine. Yeah, the water pump was leaking again. Sh..! Sure enough, the leak was coming from the back of the relocation plate where it seals against the engine block. I re-drained the radiator and removed everything associated with the removal of the pump and of course the pump itself. 15 minutes tops. Lots of practice! The leak was at the very bottom, an area that is only 1/4” thick and looked as if I didn’t put any silicone on it. Evidently, whatever I’m doing is not working and I needed to go back and read directions. Something most men don’t like to do. The instructions stated “Apply a 1/4” bead and assemble immediately tightening until the sealant had squeezes out a bit. Let it sit for 1 hour the tighten an additional 1/2 turn.” Previously I had applied the sealant very sparingly so as not to get gobs squeezing out into the coolant jacket. I know from experience that practice sometimes creates more issues down the road. Thus the reason I prefer gaskets over silicone. I suppose I applied it a little too sparingly. Another reason may be that I only waited 1/2 hour to let it setup before tightening. This time I applied about a 3/16” bead, assembled and tightened until I got a squeeze then let it set for the hour then tightened the additional 1/2 turn. I didn’t feel that was enough to keep the water pump from coming loose so I decided to re-torque in 24 hours after it fully cured.

Leaving the radiator and the remaining parts off so I can re-tighten and refill again, I turned my attention to the transmission to check the oil. I rolled back the floor mat and removed the transmission cover to gain access to the tranny. The cover is another PO debacle, where a thin sheet of galvanized steel was used as the cover. The replacement was not fastened down so it is easy to remove. This will be replaced in the future when I replace the floor pans. The tranny plug was easy to remove and I added the rest of the bottle, which wasn’t quite enough to top it off but hopefully enough that the tranny won’t disintegrate. Time to quit, tomorrow is another day!

Last edited by Phak1; 01/19/2020 1:51 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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7/16/19: She Finally Hit the Road: For Fathers Day, my wife purchased a set of NY vintage plates for me to install on our truck. Two 1951 plates with a single 52’ tag for the back plate. The only place that handles vintage plate registration is Albany NY, so today we made the one hour trip to see if we could get her registered. We did get her registered but with new “Historical” plates instead. Turns out that there is another place in Albany the handles “Vintage” plates and that is thru the mail. Leave it to NY to complicate the process. There is only a few requirements to register “vintage” plates in NY. They must be original to the year of the vehicle, not repainted and the plate letters and numerals must not already be in use. With the use of computers today, I don’t see why that couldn’t have been done at any of the local DMV offices. I’ll get the vintage plates registered and on the truck soon but in the meantime she is on the road.

I installed the “Historical” plates and the registration sticker on the windshield, but before we take her first shake down cruise, I need to get her back together. I retightened the water pump and reinstalled the radiator, fan, belt hoses and the other associated parts, added antifreeze and checked for leaks. So far so good. Started her up and let her heat up and rechecked for leaks and found none. Yea! Another success!

Time to get my wife and take her for a spin. The first thing I noticed before I even got her into gear was I felt naked without a seat belt. I know that I am from an era that thought nothing of putting our sleeping kids in the back of a station wagon with their pillows and blankets, so you could get an early start on your vacation or in the bed of a pickup truck to go and get some ice cream, but with more than 30 years of required use, I got used to it and now use them religiously.

When we started down the road, the truck was all over the road, following every bump and curve, with quite a bit of steering wheel play. The next issue is the brakes. It did stop the truck, but not without allot of force, a little bit of squeal and allot of anticipation, which would not be good in an emergency. This issue definitely made the top of my “To-Do” list.

Next issue was she is extremely noisy at 40 MPH. At 45 MPH, I felt like I was really pushing her past her limits and I didn’t feel safe. The only good thing that I could say was we drove her for about 16 miles and she ran good, real strong and she didn’t overheat.

My wife was not impressed. To tell you the truth, I was a bit disappointed myself. I still have allot of work to do, but I have the confidence that as I work out these mechanical issues, I’ll get her tamed down to the point that my wife will fall in love with her as I have. Much, more work to do!

Attachments
84DDDC50-2914-44F0-A677-45FDB0F3A7F1.jpeg (187.93 KB, 378 downloads)

Last edited by Phak1; 01/22/2020 1:38 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,518
S
'Bolter
'Bolter
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Hang in there, with the truck all over the road = clearance in the steering system as you know, Seems the clearances can all add up, so if you have loose tie rod ends and worn kingpins and a loose steering box, they all add up to a scary experience, then it is multiplied times two with those fat tires you have on there. You can get it to steer very well but you are going to have to throw parts at the old girl. Course the same thing with the brakes, just need to throw more parts at it, clean it all, you and adjust it, fix the leaky wheel cylinders and so on.
Dont give up and hang in there, plenty of us run around with original style parts just fine, still safe and sound.

Steve

Last edited by sstock; 01/22/2020 2:44 PM.

1953 Chevrolet 3100
261 cu inch, sm420, 3.55 rear, torque tube still,omaha orange, still 6 volt, RPO green glass, side carrier spare, all done
In the DITY Gallery
Video of the 261 running

1964 GMC 1000
305 Big Block V6, sm420, the next cab off restoration
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 29,262
Bubba - Curmudgeon
Bubba - Curmudgeon
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 29,262
In New York state there is a difference between "historical" plates and "vintage" plates (see links at bottom).
North Carolina has different rules and procedures.

Also, in NY you have to have an inspection every year; buy, in NC there is no inspection after registration.

I have done one vintage plate in-person at the Albany, NY DMV office and one by mail (sent in a color photograph) and one at my local/main DMV office (Troy, NY DMV). I could not use my local/town DMV office.

In both states:
If the year of your vehicle only had one plate, you can use one plate.
If the year of you vehicle had two plates, you must have both plates.

In NY, if you take your vehicle off the road (and/or let registration lapse), you must send your plate to a DMV office for "storage".





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'Bolter
'Bolter
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I run a 1963 NC Farm Truck Plate on Ginger. As long as you are legally registered and insured and have the "new" tag under the seat to show your friendly local LEO your good in North Carolina. I live very close to Virginia and usually buy all my fuel over there as its cheaper and have been pulled a few times. I find that kind of funny as all you have to do is go into your local farm store in Virginia and buy a "farm use" placard and hang it on and drive anything down the road with relative impunity/ Seriously, I have seen everything from Pick-ups to relatively new Benz's driving down the road.

Last edited by 63 C-10 Carolina Fleetside; 01/22/2020 4:24 PM.

1963 Chevy C-10 Fleetside
2010 Chevy HHR SS GONE, NOT FORGETTEN
2003 GMC Z71
2016 Silverado High Country 2500 Diesel
2012 Chevy Camero SS Convertible
2012 Indian Chief Vintage serial #002 motorcycle
2016 Indian Chief Roadmaster

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S
'Bolter
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Seems like all states differ in the minutiae. My state, Washington, has both collector and restored plates. In each the vehicle has to be at least 30 years old and the vehicle can only be used for parades and car shows and pleasure without compensation. It is a one time registration fee that is lifetime. Like usual many are abusing the privilege and some are using these vehicles as every day drivers. Now there is legislation to have five year renewals. Some ruin it for all others, but I digress.

Last edited by sstock; 01/22/2020 4:49 PM.

1953 Chevrolet 3100
261 cu inch, sm420, 3.55 rear, torque tube still,omaha orange, still 6 volt, RPO green glass, side carrier spare, all done
In the DITY Gallery
Video of the 261 running

1964 GMC 1000
305 Big Block V6, sm420, the next cab off restoration
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
AD Addict & Tinkerer
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
Quote
In NY, if you take your vehicle off the road (and/or let registration lapse), you must send your plate to a DMV office for "storage".
NY State Historical Plates

Just to clarify, that applies to Historical plates only. If you read down further it states “DMV offices do not store vintage plates.”

Last edited by Phak1; 10/21/2024 11:53 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,518
S
'Bolter
'Bolter
S Offline
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What if you purchased your plate it still belongs to NY DMV?


1953 Chevrolet 3100
261 cu inch, sm420, 3.55 rear, torque tube still,omaha orange, still 6 volt, RPO green glass, side carrier spare, all done
In the DITY Gallery
Video of the 261 running

1964 GMC 1000
305 Big Block V6, sm420, the next cab off restoration
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 1,003
G
'Bolter
'Bolter
G Offline
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 1,003
Pa will require them to be surrendered also or impose a fine if the insurance is lapsed. I didnt and dont feel like reading all 10 pages of this post so im just chiming in. If it aint " on the right track", please disregard.. not me

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AD Addict & Tinkerer
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No, NY doesn’t own my “Vintage” plates. Thus the reason “DMV does not store vintage plates.” Any plate issued by DMV, is just like PA where you have to turn them in.


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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7/18/19: After posting my ”Wondering Truck” issue on “Stovebolt”, one of the first things that was suggested was tire pressure. Did I ever check the pressures since we got the truck In February? No, Duh! How stupid I feel. In my defense, the tires were new when we bought the truck, they looked properly inflated and they looked good. Not much of a defense. “Guilty as charged” of improper tire maintenance. Logic dictated that was the first place to start.The pressures were all over the place from 24 PSI To 39 PSI. After checking a suggested website for tire pressures that you could punch in your particular tire, size and load rating, I decided that 26 PSI was a good place to start.

My grandson (who has never added air to a tire) and I, set the tire pressures at 26 PSI. I did the first to show him how it’s done and he did the rest. Another test drive with my grandson riding shotgun proved that it helped immensely. As HRL (Hot Rod Lincoln) once said in one of his responses to my post, I’m no longer “herding the truck down the road“. I still have way too much play in the wheel, so the next step also suggested by this forum, is to adjust the steering box. So a trip to Wally World for a fish scale is in order.

The truck tracked perfectly straight down the road when I let go of the wheel, but seemed like it had a bit of understeer. After posting my success on “Stovebolt”, it was suggested by adding a pound or two might help with the understeer. I have that gut feeling inside, that this is only the tip of the iceberg, but I have to start somewhere, so I give it a try!




Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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Posts: 4,100
7/21/19: Today my wife, grandson and myself, went to ATCA (Antique Truck Club of America) Truck Show at Washington County Fair Grounds in NY. There was mostly big rigs there and just a few smaller trucks. Two AD Stovebolts, in which I didn’t take any pictures, an art deco with a gorgeous grille and another art deco 4x4. I enjoyed sharing some knowledge of the old trucks with my grandson. Overall a great day!
Attachments
51125656-14EC-4B32-B47F-676CFC59E912.jpeg (156.76 KB, 303 downloads)
4A19B4E4-DA55-4265-8ED9-A080B2A9582F.jpeg (157.53 KB, 300 downloads)


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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7/22/19: I had some time to look at my wandering truck issue and lackluster ability to stop the truck. After jacking up the truck and supporting her on the frame with jack stands, I remove the front wheels and brake drums so I could inspect the brakes. Once I removed the spindle nut and outer bearings the drums came right off. The shoes and drums on both sides were loaded with grease. Further inspection showed the grease seals were shot. The shoes, which looked to be new, were covered with grease rendering them useless. New seals and shoes were in order. I ordered a new set of AC Delco shoes from RockAuto.

When I disassembled the drivers side brakes assembly, I noticed that one of the lock washers on the bottom bolts that attach the backing plate were installed on the wrong side, in other words p, installed under the bolt and not the nut. Removal of those bolts proved harder than it looked as one of the steel spacers (sleeve) between the knuckle assembly and backing plate were rusted solid to the bolt. I tried soaking the spacer with PB Blaster and holding it with a Vice Grip while I used an impact, but it only spun in the Vice Grip Pliers. I removed the whole backing plate to allow me better access. Once I got the plate to the bench, with a little heat on the directed to the spacer, I was able to drive the bolt out of the spacer.

Disassembly of the passengers side went a bit easier. This time I disconnected the tie rod from the steering arm, removed the whole backing plate assembly, then removed the spacers from the bolts. Again a little heat was in order. I media blasted all of the brake components and steering arms, applied a coat of prime then a coat of my favorite spray paint, Ace Premium Satin Black. This stuff is amazing. Has primer in it, two coat coverage, drys quick with a nozzle that sprays in an elliptical pattern just like a spray gun. Unfortunately, I didn’t have enough, so off the the hardware store.

Attachments
0F804BA5-74E8-4196-917E-7BE2818A99B0.jpeg (129.38 KB, 293 downloads)

Last edited by Phak1; 01/30/2020 2:09 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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8/7/19:I made some time to work on the truck today and boy did I open a can of worms. The drivers side rear spring mount which is riveted to the frame is loose, in addition to both spring pivot bolts that have slop. After removal I confirmed their degraded condition requiring replacement. I also checked the king pins and tie rod ends. The tie rods ends are good only needing cleaning and re-greasing but the king pins are another story. The passenger side had a bit of slop, about .006” - .008” of radial movement as measured at the bottom of the yoke. I’m not talking about thrust clearance. The drivers side had .002” - .003”. So my question is how much movement is too much? I posted that question on stovebolt and I’m waiting for some responses. My gut feeling is at least the passenger side king pin will need to be replaced.

Since I almost had the entire front axle out I decided to remove the shackles and springs to check them Out more thoroughly. The shackles checked out OK Requiring only replacement of the grease seals but both rear spring eyes are worn thru the bushings into the main leafs in the spring assembly’s and need replacement. Now the question, do I replace both front spring assembly’s or disassemble the spring sets and replace just the main spring? I think disassembly is required to assess the damage before I decide. It’s no wonder the truck wandered!

I’m feeling a bit overwhelmed right now.
Attachments
05BEE5F2-19D2-4AFB-8B78-555B0C26AE9E.jpeg (127.58 KB, 259 downloads)


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Crusty Old Sarge
Crusty Old Sarge
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Phil, I know that you'er playing catch up on your postings so most of this work has probably been completed by now. If you had that many issues with the front spring sets, they may also be sagging a bit more than stock height. I'm sure that replacing the bushings and king pins will tighten everything up but it wont help the spring pack. Did you replace the rivets with grade 8 bolts or just heat and tighten them back down?


~ Craig
1958 Viking 4400
"The Book of Thor"
Read the story in the DITY
1960 Chevrolet C10
"A Family Heirloom"
Follow the story in the DITY Gallery
'59 Apache 31, 327 V8 (0.030 over), Muncie M20 4 Speed, GM 10 Bolt Rear... long term project (30 years and counting)

Come Bleed or Blister, something has got to give!!! | Living life in the SLOW lane
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,374
Moderator - The Electrical Bay
Moderator - The Electrical Bay
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I'm facing a similar issue with my truck. The front spring mount is egged out and the bolt is loose with the truck sitting flat. The other side was already replaced, so Hopefully, I can find a new mount soon.


Another quality post.
Real Trucks Rattle
HELP! The Paranoids are after me!
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AD Addict & Tinkerer
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TUTS 59 & Rusty Rod, you’re right, it’s already done and full details will follow in a few days on my post. To answer your questions though, I replaced the rivets with grade 5, 1/2 NF bolts nuts and lock washers and I bought two new main springs from Classic Parts and reused the rest of the spring pack.

I decided to use nuts and bolts because I had no equipment to re-rivet the existing rivets (a new impact hammer because mine wasn't large enough and the proper bit) and the limited amount of room I had with the engine installed. I’m glad I did because a couple of the rivet holes were wallowed out to .450”. I doubt it I could have tightened a 3/8” rivet that much.

Last edited by Phak1; 02/02/2020 8:28 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,522
Moderator: Welcome Centre, Southern Bolters, Legion Hall
Moderator: Welcome Centre, Southern Bolters, Legion Hall
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.....the only consolation in finding, and fixing these problems, it driving down the road and knowing you are SAFE. Most of us spend days,months,years getting these on the road and I learned over 20 years ago to take it one step at a time.
IT WILL BE REWARDING....and you will enjoy it. Thats a promise.

Stick with it Phil, the end goal is in sight.


1937 Chevy Pickup
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1952 Chevy Panel
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1950 Chevy Coupe
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'Bolter
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Originally Posted by Achipmunk
.....the only consolation in finding, and fixing these problems, it driving down the road and knowing you are SAFE. Most of us spend days,months,years getting these on the road and I learned over 20 years ago to take it one step at a time.
IT WILL BE REWARDING....and you will enjoy it. Thats a promise.

Stick with it Phil, the end goal is in sight.

Exactly Chip!


1953 Chevrolet 3100
261 cu inch, sm420, 3.55 rear, torque tube still,omaha orange, still 6 volt, RPO green glass, side carrier spare, all done
In the DITY Gallery
Video of the 261 running

1964 GMC 1000
305 Big Block V6, sm420, the next cab off restoration
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Crusty Old Sarge
Crusty Old Sarge
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Originally Posted by Achipmunk
.....the only consolation in finding, and fixing these problems, it driving down the road and knowing you are SAFE. Most of us spend days,months,years getting these on the road and I learned over 20 years ago to take it one step at a time.
IT WILL BE REWARDING....and you will enjoy it. Thats a promise.

Stick with it Phil, the end goal is in sight.

Alvin, Where were you 30 years ago...


~ Craig
1958 Viking 4400
"The Book of Thor"
Read the story in the DITY
1960 Chevrolet C10
"A Family Heirloom"
Follow the story in the DITY Gallery
'59 Apache 31, 327 V8 (0.030 over), Muncie M20 4 Speed, GM 10 Bolt Rear... long term project (30 years and counting)

Come Bleed or Blister, something has got to give!!! | Living life in the SLOW lane
Joined: Feb 2019
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Thank you all for giving me several shoulders to lean on. Your support is reassuring. It’s a disappointment when you find these problems but I do know its for the best. Thanks again!


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
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Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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8/8/19: Today I’m tackling the removal of the loose spring mount and have decided to use bolts instead of attempting to re-rivet them. The limited space and lack of the proper equipment (my pneumatic impact hammer was not large enough for the task), was the driving force. Removing them was not an easy task. After reading several post on this forum, I decided to drill the heads, out to 3/8, then shear them off with a impact hammer. That worked well, however when I tried to use a drift to punch them out, the rivets just rung indicating they were really tight. Using a technique I learned as a machinist, I drilled a bit deeper with a 5/16” bit (so I didn’t nick the spring mount or frame) and without the use of a lubricant (so it would heat up the rivet). I drilled an additional 3/8”, then the rivets punched out.

As a machinist, I’ve removed many bushings by concentrating heat on the bushing and avoiding the outer casing as much as possible. The science behind the idea is the bushing is going to expand with the heat but the cooler casing will not allow it to grow outward so it expands inward. When it cools it contracts the OD and the bushing usually falls out, taps or presses out easily.

In this case the drill acted as the heat source and it was enough to loosen the rivet as it cooled. The rivets on the side of the frame were fairly easy but the two under the frame were another story. Laying on my back, I tried drilling out the rivets with little progress. I ended up using a 2’ long piece of 1x2 pine and a block of wood as a pivot to apply some upwards pressure on the drill. That finally did the trick. What I wouldn’t do for a lift right now.

As a apprentice mechanic/machinist in a Nuclear Power Station, I learned this trick from an elderly German gas welder. This gentleman’s gas welds looked almost as nice as TIG. Fifty years ago, most senior men from the trades had the mentality that they needed to protect their jobs. They would send you off to get tools or to perform some other menial task when a critical part of the job, so you wouldn’t see what they were doing. But there were a few who shared their knowledge, and thank God he was one. I learned allot from this man and think about him every time I pick up a torch.

It was the right call removing the spring mount rather than trying to re-rivet it. The holes in the spring mount were tight, but ones in the frame were oblong. The worst was .450”. Looks like I’ll be opening them up to 1/2”. Tomorrow’s another day!

Last edited by Phak1; 02/05/2020 2:29 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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8/14/19 Today I tackled the removal of the kin pins. I first tried to loosened the king pin retaining pins from their taper by loosening the nut, turning it to the end of the thread so the nut protected the thread then tapping on the nut to drive out the pin. This was starting to distort the thread and the the retaining pin didn’t budge, so I threaded the nut down so it just had about a 1/16” gap between the nut and the steering knuckle, then added a second nut to aid in protecting the thread. This did the trick and I was able to hit the pins with enough force to get the pin to move, then I reset the nuts to drive the pins out. On to removal of the grease caps. I used a Dremel with a wafer wheel to grind out the punch marks retaining the caps, then drilled a 1/4” hole in each cap to give me something to pry on. Using a small cold chisel, I was able to remove the caps. The king pins were easy to get out. I used my new 20 ton HF press but I could just driven them out with a punch and a hammer. Thats because they looked new and appears to have just been replaced by a previous owner without addressing the real issue. Unfortunately it’s the ID of the steering knuckle where the OD of the bushing rides that is worn. I took measurements of the pins and of the bushings and they appeared perfect. The ID of the spindles are worn. The good news is that the axle is in great shape. Nice and straight and the ID of the holes where the king pins attach are perfect.

The clearance was as follows:
Drivers: .003” on the top and .005” on the bottom.
Passengers: .002” on the top and .006” on the bottom.

It appears that I need oversized bushings and a reamer to match, or the complete replacement of the spindles. A subsequent search on the internet returned zero results in both scenario’s. After posting on “Stovebolt” forums, it was suggested to use Loctite 660 to fill in the gap and secure the bushings. This apparently is a common and accepted practice in the industry. It has a second advantage of preventing additional wear on the steering knuckle. What a relief knowing I don’t have to replace the scarce steering knuckles.

Last edited by Phak1; 06/26/2021 11:46 AM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Crusty Old Sarge
Crusty Old Sarge
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
I farmed the King Pin out to my machine shop, I know my limits wink


~ Craig
1958 Viking 4400
"The Book of Thor"
Read the story in the DITY
1960 Chevrolet C10
"A Family Heirloom"
Follow the story in the DITY Gallery
'59 Apache 31, 327 V8 (0.030 over), Muncie M20 4 Speed, GM 10 Bolt Rear... long term project (30 years and counting)

Come Bleed or Blister, something has got to give!!! | Living life in the SLOW lane
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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A good part of my career (27years), I spent in a machine shop so farming it out for me would have been blasphemous!


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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8/25/19: I didn’t get much done on the truck last week as my Mom (who is ninety four) and sister came to visit. I feel truly blessed to have my Mom still around, so time spent with her is priceless and working on the truck takes a backseat.

I needed to determine if I could replace just the main leaf spring and reuse the rest of the spring stack. I used a small pry bar to pry open the spring clamps. This method worked on the first spring assembly but on the second it created a crack on one of the bends. I want to reuse the clamps to keep the originality. I broke out my torch to heat the bends so I could open them without breaking them. This worked on the remaining ones, but I still have to repair the broken one if I reuse the springs. I placed each spring assembly into the vice sideways, then loosened up the center bolt and opened the vice slowly releasing tension on the spring until it came apart.

The first thing I noticed was an odd looking spring on the drivers side. It stuck out like a sore thumb. There were nine leaves on the drivers side and only eight on the passengers side. Further inspection on the drivers side showed one spring was cracked from the center bolt out to one side. It appears a PO added a leaf to compensate for the one that was cracked. I suspect the truck was sagging. The odd spring was longer than the cracked spring so I figured I could cut it down to replace the cracked one if the rest on the stacks were good.

At this point, the remaining springs from the stack looked good but I’ll reserve final evaluation until cleaning is done. The one clamp that cracked needed to be removed from the spring so I could weld up the crack. I used my new twenty ton press (a bit of overkill) and just pressed out the rivet. I will be making replacement rivets on the lathe. After reworking the six clamps with a bit of heat, my MIG, a vice and a ball peen, I spent the rest of the day media blasting and painting the remaining hardware (shackles, etc.). The springs themselves would need to be cleaned with a wire wheel on my Metabo (side grinder). That will be for another day.
Attachments
FB58B8CC-F884-4AF8-BF9F-9E0056ED2074.jpeg (530.64 KB, 293 downloads)
CDA9F597-C74A-4091-80D7-8EA15CFBF74E.jpeg (516.25 KB, 292 downloads)


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,522
Moderator: Welcome Centre, Southern Bolters, Legion Hall
Moderator: Welcome Centre, Southern Bolters, Legion Hall
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,522
Looking good and i enjoy reading your post.

You can buy those rivets from McMaster-Car at a good price. I think mine were 50 to a box.
For the straps that hold the spring pack together I purchased a 3 ft 3/4" wide steel strip from Lowes for cheap. It bent nicely and I just drilled a hole in it.
Depending on the condition of your springs you may want to consider using vinyl spring liners with the lip on it which keeps the liner in place. I used them on my 52 panel and like them.

.....just some ideas. Keep us posted.

EDIT: Shoot me a PM let me know how many rivets you need and I'll drop some in a mail pouch for you.

Last edited by Achipmunk; 02/11/2020 3:52 PM.

1937 Chevy Pickup
In the Gallery
1952 Chevy Panel
In the Gallery
More photos
1950 Chevy Coupe
Pictures!

I'd rather walk and carry a Chevy hub cap than ride in a Ferd.
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you smile
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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I really appreciate the offer, but I already made the ones I need on my lathe. I agree on the liners and placed a order with Speedway.
Attachments


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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Posts: 4,100
9/6/19: My wife and I went to the Adirondack Nationals put on by GoodGuys in Lake George NY today. This show has been a favorite of ours since we first started vacationing in this area back in the late 80’s. We went looking for ideas for our truck. Although most of these vehicles were absolutely fabulous we didn’t really find what we liked but instead what we didn’t like. Most of the AD trucks we saw were resto-mod’s with V8’s and all of the other amenities that go along with that style. We didn’t leave with allot of ideas, but we saw some amazing work by some very talented craftsman. Every time I go to these shows, I get torn between restoration and custom. My wife and I agree at this point that our truck is too original to go resto-mod, but instead, restoration (within reason) is our chosen path.

This show is too big for us to see the whole show in one day. We planned to return the next day but that didn’t pan out because when we arrived at 11AM, we couldn’t find any parking. We instead had to be satisfied with a very slow cruise up and down Canada Street watching the cars, trucks and the occasional burnout urged on by the spectators. Overall a great weekend!


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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9/7/19: Over the last couple of weeks, I have been cleaning, painting and waiting for parts to arrive to get my front end back together. I started prepping the springs for paint and reassembly. After making a weld repair on the drivers side spring clamp, I used my (garage sale find) railroad track as the anvil, a ball peen hammer and a rivet I made on my lathe, to re-riveted the clamp on to the spring.

To clean up the springs, I used a wire cup on my side grinder to remove the grime and rust then ground out the ridges left behind by adjacent springs. This was a time consuming task requiring about two hours for just the passengers side assembly. A bit of wax and grease remover and a nice coat of my favorite rattle can paint, and that set was ready for reassembly. I was burnt out with wire brushing and grinding so I left the drivers side for another day.

Next on my list was the loose spring mount. I first secured the mount tight to the frame using 3/8” bolts and bolts. On the first hole, I tried using progressive drills in slow speed. Starting about a 32nd of an inch larger and working up, but the bits would only dig in and stop the drill. If I ran it at high speed with light pressure it would drill but then start to chatter. A trick I used as a machinist was to flatten the cutting edge of the bit slightly by either grinding or using a a small stone (so it scrapes rather then cuts). This would stop the bit from digging in, especially in soft materials like brass or copper but would also work on soft steel. Not having any sacrificial bits like I did when I was working and I not wanting to have to resharpen numerous bits, I decided to try to enlarge the holes using just the reamer. This worked out nicely, fairly easy to drill and left very clean holes. I had previously bought grade 5, 1/2”-20 x 2” shoulder bolts, nuts and lock washers figuring on cutting the length to fit. Although the reamed holes were to size, the bolts measured undersize by about .002”, so I added some Loctite 660 to fill the gap.

This may spark a conversation on rivets vs bolts. The tensile strength of a single 1/2”x20 grade 5 bolt is 19,200 lbs. and there are four of these bolts in two different planes. I don’t think it will ever pose a problem. I will however check the torque on these bolts on a regular basis. They say hindsight is 20-20. If I had to do it again, I would buy a .010” undersized reamer and size the bolts on the lathe to fit.

Attachments
8A6575F4-BA1E-4F30-B61F-9F66342772FE.jpeg (155.02 KB, 308 downloads)
7E46DAF1-5EB6-449C-8005-0AD47DAB1CCE.jpeg (362.45 KB, 309 downloads)


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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9/8/19: First on my list today is the cleaning and prepping the drivers side springs for reassembly. Previously I found that it had nine leafs vs the passenger side having only eight. I was able to cut that extra spring to take the place of the cracked one I found (sometimes things work themself’s out nicely). I accomplished this by slowly cutting with a side grinder and a cut-off wheel so I wouldn’t generate too much heat. Another two hours of cleaning with a wire wheel, grinding out the ridges, a quick paint job with rattle can satin black, a day to dry and the drivers side is ready for reassembly.

I needed to get the steering knuckles ready for reassembly. The 1/2 ton has floating bushings that are not secured to the knuckle. However in my case the ID of both knuckles were worn between .002” and .006” thousands and after recommendations from fellow “Bolters”, I decided to use Loctite 660 to secure them in, hopefully preventing further damage to the knuckles. I think this design, limited to the 1/2 tons, was to help the truck owner’s change the king pins and bushings themself’s. With the bushings not being a press fit (3/4 ton and up have pressed in bushings), it would make changing them an easier task. This however sets up the knuckles up for wear. A poor design in my opinion. These are getting harder to find in good shape and are at a significant cost, so preventing any more damage is a priority.

After coating the new bushings with Loctite 660, inserting them into the knuckle, insuring the lubrication holes were aligned, I used the king pin to keep them in alignment then set them aside to dry.


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
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9/9/19: Today reassembly of the leaf springs was the task. I had previously purchased spring liners to install between the leafs so starting with the new main leaf, I cut my first liner about a 1/4” longer than the spring. Each spring has a hole in the center for the center bolt. The liners needed this hole which I accomplished by using a transfer punch and the spring as the die. After placing the liner on top of the leaf, inserting the transfer punch from the bottom thru the center bolt hole, I pressed the punch into the liner leaving a pin hole mark. Now insuring the the liner and spring didn’t move, I took the transfer punch, located it on the pin hole mark from the top and drove the punch thru the spring. This left a perfect hole. I started stacking the leaf and liner combination on the new center bolt I had previously bought, insuring the lip of the liners were facing down so they would shed water. Six more repetitions and a subsequent tightening of the center bolt and the spring assembly was ready for crimping. Prior to crimping the spring clamps, I cut the center bolt about an 1/8” long and used a ball peen hammer and my vice to peen the bolt into a rivet shape to keep the nut from backing out. I also used the vice to help with folding the spring clamps over on the spring assembly. I was concerned that they may break when I hammered them over but that was not the case. They folded over and tightened nicely to the spring stack.

I followed the same sequence for that drivers side with the same result. The springs were ready to go back in the truck.
Attachments
990CE5C9-10B2-4384-BAF8-A53EC9598532.jpeg (480.02 KB, 282 downloads)
AA7C3E87-3BF9-40AE-8F33-7565E7361FAC.jpeg (176.22 KB, 285 downloads)
5E1EC373-4FF9-4BAA-B9DF-0354704F1DFD.jpeg (198.37 KB, 282 downloads)

Last edited by Phak1; 02/22/2020 1:23 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 620
D
'Bolter
'Bolter
D Offline
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 620
I'm late in reading this (I'm a new guy), this is the best site on the Web. I'm an old guy but I can tell you to be patient, In my racing day's I didn't have patience due to schedule's etc. Now I love working on my 54 - 3100, for me it's great therapy. Have a good time and enjoy, keep us updated. Doc.


Currently making 1954 3100 better than new and Genetics
Joined: Feb 2019
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The one thing I learned thru life is patience. When I was a young teen building plastic model cars, I couldn’t wait for the paint to fully dry before assemblIng the car. I messed up a quite few before I got it right. Now that I’m retired, I have allot more patience, allot more time and allot less energy so it kinda works out right!

My problem now is I love to work on my truck (definitely a Stovebolt addict) so balancing my time between my truck and my family seems to be my biggest issue.


Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Crusty Old Sarge
Crusty Old Sarge
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,993
Phil, I'm having the same issue with balancing time, It's T -Ball season here for my youngest Grand Kids, and Little League for my 12 year old Grandson. After losing his older Brother last fall my time is better spent with him. My truck has always waited patiently. It's All Good... thumbs_up


~ Craig
1958 Viking 4400
"The Book of Thor"
Read the story in the DITY
1960 Chevrolet C10
"A Family Heirloom"
Follow the story in the DITY Gallery
'59 Apache 31, 327 V8 (0.030 over), Muncie M20 4 Speed, GM 10 Bolt Rear... long term project (30 years and counting)

Come Bleed or Blister, something has got to give!!! | Living life in the SLOW lane
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
AD Addict & Tinkerer
AD Addict & Tinkerer
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 4,100
9/11/19: Next on the list is to get the springs mounted. I found it easier to mount the front of the spring, the side with the shackle than the back that uses a single bolt. This bolt is very tight and with the front being supported by the shackle, it helped with the alignment of the bolt to the frame mount. After mounting the drivers side, I found that the front shackle had a bit of movement that was not in the passengers side. I had not noticed this before and will need to be replaced.

On to the front axle and new king pins. With the steering knuckle bushings already set in place. Starting with the passengers side, I placed the knuckle with the thrust bearing and tried to insert it in the axle. There wasn’t enough room. Further inspection revealed that the upper bushing had slipped down slightly which prevented me from fitting it into the axle. I was able to remedy the situation by using a draw file technique to file it level with the steering knuckle, I then chamfered the bushing, blew it out and it fit like a glove. Now I was able to fit it to the axle and insert the king pin. Using a wood clamp to remove the slack, I measured the gap between the top of the axle and the bottom of the upper bushing. The gap was .009 thousands of inch. I inserted .005” total shims and reduced this gap to .004” which is within tolerance. Before reassembly, I coated the axle where the king pin rides and the tapered retaining pin with a coat of anti seize. I also packed the thrust bushing with grease prior to reassembly. Once reassembled. I inserted the dust caps, expanded them with a small ball peen hammer, then staked them in four spots with a center punch to help prevent them from falling out. I repeated this procedure for the drivers side. This side only required one shim to get the assembly within tolerance. After a good greasing with the grease gun, the axle was ready for installation.

Positioning the axle under the truck by myself, I used my floor jack to raise it. This however did not work too well as it wanted to topple. Once I got the axle contacting the springs, it stabilized it. After positioning the caster shims and inserting the u-bolts, it became apparent that one u-bolt on each side, was not going to be long enough to stick completely thru the nut. This was due to the spring liners that add a bit of height to the spring stack. I foresaw this with the center bolt but not with the u-bolts, an over-site on my part. It was however long enough to continue reassembly knowing that it would have to be changed before her next test drive.

I reinstalled the shocks and called it a day! More to do but I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.
Attachments
C555E7BE-C144-4E8A-9179-3E984D79B015.jpeg (147.78 KB, 224 downloads)
F806034F-2D85-402A-A616-25411F16D724.jpeg (162.48 KB, 226 downloads)

Last edited by Phak1; 02/25/2020 2:00 PM.

Phil
Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals

1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube
Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes
Project Journals
Stovebolt Gallery Forum
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