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#995535 Mon Dec 30 2013 04:04 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 90
C
Wrench Fetcher
so if someone decided to swap the axles in a 4400 to a more common dually 8 lug does that mean its not really a big bolt anymore? wouldn't that lower the gvwr but lighten the truck so would it really make a difference. opinions suggestions. pictures. i like the idea of running big rig wheels and tires. keeping kind of original looking. the 8 lug to 10 lug adapters are ugly and clutter a full floating axle.

chromesnot #995574 Mon Dec 30 2013 02:28 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 9,189
G
.
If your truck you can do what you wish.
What are you really asking?


1951 GMC 250 in the Project Journals [stovebolt.com]
1948 Chevrolet 6400 [stovebolt.com] - Detroit Diesel 4-53T - Roadranger 10 speed overdrive - 4 wheel disc brakes
1952 Chevrolet 3800 pickup [stovebolt.com]
---All pictures [picasaweb.google.com]---
"First, get a clear notion of what you desire to accomplish, and then in all probability you will succeed in doing it..." -Henry Maudslay-
chromesnot #995870 Tue Dec 31 2013 08:52 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,736
Shop Shark
You (and everyone else) are welcome to participate in any of the Forums here on the Bolt if that is your concern. It's your truck so you decide.


1953 Chevy 5-window 3100
In the Stovebolt Gallery
More pix on Picturetrail

Dave
Engine & Driveline Moderator

If you can't make seventy by an easy road, don't go. ~~ Mark Twain
chromesnot #996152 Thu Jan 02 2014 01:29 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 418
J
Shop Shark
When you say more common, do you mean more modern, or more common like your average one ton dually?

If it's a modern axle out of a newer 1.5 ton or larger truck, that would still make it a big bolt.

If it's one out of a one ton dually, I wouldnt consider it to be a big bolt anymore, in my opinion.

If you are looking to go with a more modern axle & keep the heavier load capacity, do what Grigg did, I believe he went with modern axles with disc brakes & kept it as a big bolt. The beauty of the modern axles, is you can also use modern wheels.

Last edited by JeffL; Thu Jan 02 2014 01:37 AM.
chromesnot #996558 Fri Jan 03 2014 07:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 90
C
Wrench Fetcher
Im kind of wanting a daily 1.5 ton. An overall work truck but I want to go 4wd cause I can. Problem is a 1.5 ton steer axle. The Dana super 60 is what is used on the f550 front axle but its hard to find and stupid expensive. I found a 4wd 1.5 ton fire truck but I don't know if I want to buy another truck for the axle. Unless price was incredible.

chromesnot #996636 Sat Jan 04 2014 02:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 11
K
New Guy
I'm looking at a similar 4x4 conversion. I've pretty much resigned myself to 8-lug due to availability. Keep in mind that these trucks only had about a 10,000 GVWR, which is about the same as a modern 3/4 ton truck. I think modern 1-ton axles should give more than adequate payload.

Also keep in mind that front springs on your truck are probably about 10" closer together than a modern truck which will definitely cause issues.

Last edited by kert; Sat Jan 04 2014 02:13 AM.
chromesnot #996657 Sat Jan 04 2014 03:53 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 9,189
G
.
An AD 2 ton is usually 16,000lb and 14,000lb for a 1.5 ton


1951 GMC 250 in the Project Journals [stovebolt.com]
1948 Chevrolet 6400 [stovebolt.com] - Detroit Diesel 4-53T - Roadranger 10 speed overdrive - 4 wheel disc brakes
1952 Chevrolet 3800 pickup [stovebolt.com]
---All pictures [picasaweb.google.com]---
"First, get a clear notion of what you desire to accomplish, and then in all probability you will succeed in doing it..." -Henry Maudslay-
Grigg #996817 Sat Jan 04 2014 06:25 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 11
K
New Guy
Originally Posted by Grigg
An AD 2 ton is usually 16,000lb and 14,000lb for a 1.5 ton


OK, looking at the specs on my '41, the GVWR is between 7700 and 14,000 depending on options. I would still put that in the class of a modern 1-ton DRW truck.

Looking at this , I'd say a Dana 60 front axle should be adequate for a front axle assuming you appropriately sized springs/wheels/tires.

chromesnot #996973 Sun Jan 05 2014 06:31 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 9,189
G
.
That chart might be for rear axles only, a front Dana 60 May have a different GVW rating. Dana would be a better source for that info than Wikipedia.

Also a big factor on axle ratings are the brakes. Same axle can have small or large brakes and differing ratings even though wheel bearings and other weight supporting parts are the same.

When you say "modern" how new is that? In the last couple years 1 ton pickups are similar capacity to our old 2 tons. But several years ago that was not the case. For example my truck is now on axles from a late 80's P30 or 3500HD which have about a 14,000 lb GVW. Those are/were a nominal 1.25 ton at best, a heavy 1 ton, not considered 1.5 or 2 ton, so that era 1 ton is certainly not comparable to an AD 2 ton at 16,000 lb. I still call mine a big bolt.

Still not sure what the question is or why it's an issue?
We can all build our trucks to suit our different uses and call them what we want. Only trouble comes when overloading components, so use strong enough parts for how you will use the truck.

Grigg


1951 GMC 250 in the Project Journals [stovebolt.com]
1948 Chevrolet 6400 [stovebolt.com] - Detroit Diesel 4-53T - Roadranger 10 speed overdrive - 4 wheel disc brakes
1952 Chevrolet 3800 pickup [stovebolt.com]
---All pictures [picasaweb.google.com]---
"First, get a clear notion of what you desire to accomplish, and then in all probability you will succeed in doing it..." -Henry Maudslay-
chromesnot #997086 Sun Jan 05 2014 08:15 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 90
C
Wrench Fetcher
A dana Super 60 is larger than a standard 1 ton with a higher gvw. its a 10 lug axle that they put on F450 and F550 trucks. Bigger brakes for a higher gvw. I personally love the 10 lug but I hate the look of the 8 lug to 10 lug adapters. too cluttered. I want to keep the gvw the same if not a little more to compensate the additional weight of the front axle and motor.



Ring gear measures 9".
3.125" diameter axle tube.
Weighs in near 500 lbs. More or less depending on width and brake configurations.
OEM Inner axle shaft spline counts are 16, 23, 30, 32, 33 and 35.
40 Spline inner axle shafts and carriers are made for after market, high performance Dana 60 axles.
Pinion shaft diameter: 1.625"
Pinion shaft splines: 10 and 29
Gear ratios: 3.31:1 - 7.17:1
Carrier break: 3.31:1 - 4.10:1 and 4.56:1 - 7.17:1
Axle Shaft diameter
1.41 Front (32 Spline)
1.46 Rear (32 Spline)
Axle spline diameter
1.50 Front (35 Spline)
1.50 Rear (35 Spline)
1480 Universal Joint (Front axle)
Brakes measure 13.66" for 2011 F-250 & F-350 trucks.
Brakes measure 14.53" for 2011 F-450 trucks (13,050 GVW).


The Dana Super 60 is an upgraded version of the Dana 60 front axle.
Differences in the Dana Super 60 versus the regular Dana 60:
Larger and thicker diameter steel tubes (3.75 inches diameter and 1/2 in thick)
Larger ring and pinion which increase the contact area and overall strength.
Larger Universal Joints which increase strength and steering angle.
Super 60s use 1550 Universal Joints.
Net formed spider gears for increased strength.
All made with 35 Spline axle shafts.
This axle was used only as a medium duty unit until the Third Generation F-450 Pick up began production. The Third Generation F-450 pick up is a light duty truck. This axle is still used in the medium duty F-450 and F-550 44 trucks as well.

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