The Stovebolt.com Forums Home | Tech Tips | Gallery | FAQ | Events | Features | Search
Fixing the old truck

BUSY BOLTERS
Are you one?
Not a hanging chad... The Shop Area
continues to pull in the most views on the Stovebolt. In August alone there were over 36,294 views in those 12 forums.

Searching the Site

Get info about how to search the entire Stovebolt site here. To do a search for just the forums, get those details in the IT Shortbus fourm.
Who's Online Now
8 members (Patharr, hokiecarpenter, DES57, Hotrod Lincoln, Leo, 1 invisible), 270 guests, and 3 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
The Zone
Forum Statistics
Forums65
Topics123,442
Posts999,498
Members47,277
Most Online1,229
Jan 21st, 2020
Step-by-step instructions for pictures in the forums
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#1503739 Mon Jun 05 2023 02:45 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 105
D
'Bolter
I have a 51 3100 1/2 ton with the original 216 and three speed transmission
I have purchased a 235 from a 58 car, which comes complete with mated transmission (also 3 speed column shift manual) and all ancillaries on the engine (Manifolds, carb, starter, generator etc etc)
I had posted question in the Driveline section inviting inputs on what transmission I should enterain and actually got some engine swap advice there
I'd like to pick up the engine swap side of things here to invite further inputs on anything else I might be missing
As per the advice on the Driveline thread, I think for sure at this point will retain the original transmission, at least for now, and leave the drive-line for possible futiue consideration (or maybe not!)

Here is the relevent part of the other thread with some pointers from @Jethro in VA

Originally Posted by Jethro in Va
The 58 combo will not fit without major mods... none of the engine mounts bolt in. 168 tooth flywheel means you have to convert to 12 volts. Bell housing lacks bell crank for the 3100 shifter. Clutch linkage doesn't fit... ugh!

Mate the 235 to the 216 flywheel/ bell housing. Use the 6v stomp starter (a must... the 216 flywheel has 139 teeth. Only mates to a 6v starter. Works great with a 12v system. The 58 flywheel has 168 teeth for a 12v starter only.) Then drill 2 holes in the timing cover for a 216 front mount. The unit will now bolt right on.. Modify the waterpump to clear the radiator and mount whatever tranny you want.
Little tricky figuring the geometry of the carb linkage. I had to use the linkage from the 216..

Originally Posted by D'Ecosse
Thanks for those inputs - I hadn't posted with regard to the engine swap, thought that part was straight forward.
I'm going to post this in the engine section to invite further interaction there in this regard

The good thing about this deal is it comes with everything including transmission, bell-housing, clutch, starter and all else - manifolds, carb, etc etc
So between the two I should have most of the parts I need whichever way I go regarding an open-drive or the OEM torque tube driveline.

My system is already 12V and as you suggest the 6V starter works just fine. Cranks it over handily grin
I had planned to swap from bell-housing, back from the 216 if going with the original transmission and per the earlier advice, sounds like that would be the best plan.
So starter, bellhousing, clutch concerns etc should be moot
I'lll certainly be keeping those parts from the 235, should an open drive transmission swap be a consideration at a later time.

I had thought the 235 engine was already equipped for the Truck forward mounts; so the later car engine does not have those? I'll do some research on the required mod for making those holes in the timing cover (if someone has a link there to the detail it will save me a search)

I had recognized regarding the water pump, my understanding is there are adapters available for that and that was already a consideration.

Can you expand on the carb linkage? It's all cables on the 51 truck obviously - again, I have the 216 so anything from that is available - what exactly did you have to do?

Any other inputs would be sincerely appreciated.


'51 Chevy 3100 Truck - OEM 216 Engine; three speed column shift transmission
6 Bolt disc conversion with dual master/vacuum booster
12V alternator conversion.
235 engine in waiting grin
D'Ecosse #1503755 Mon Jun 05 2023 05:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,137
J
'Bolter
Your 1958 block ~should~ have two provisions for the throttle linkage pivot. If so, just need to move it to the correct spot and use the 216 linkage.

Looks like you’re on the right track. Get the right bellhousing. Front motor mount. Water pump.

JW51 #1503756 Mon Jun 05 2023 05:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 105
D
'Bolter
Originally Posted by JW51
Your 1958 block ~should~ have two provisions for the throttle linkage pivot. If so, just need to move it to the correct spot and use the 216 linkage.

Looks like you’re on the right track. Get the right bellhousing. Front motor mount. Water pump.
The original 216 Bell-Housing (with Flywheel, clutch and starter) all work, right?

I found this guide and thisMotor mount timing cover mod template invaluable.

Last edited by D'Ecosse; Mon Jun 05 2023 06:37 PM.

'51 Chevy 3100 Truck - OEM 216 Engine; three speed column shift transmission
6 Bolt disc conversion with dual master/vacuum booster
12V alternator conversion.
235 engine in waiting grin
D'Ecosse #1503765 Mon Jun 05 2023 06:50 PM
Joined: Jun 2022
Posts: 341
J
'Bolter
Yes, I used it all on my 216/235 conversion. Bolts right on, bolts right up. Just make sure the bell housing and flywheel are Tight.
Once you drill the holes for the front mount, you must install the new front mount Before you install the engine.

Use the pedal-to-carb linkage from the 216. The pic shows the 2 mounting positions on a 57 235. Use the one with the screw in the pic. Carefully remove the stud from the 216 and use it. The 235 stud won't work. Remove it and replace with the screw.
Compare the intake manifolds... if the 235 manifold has shorter heat box (where the carb mounts) then it's a 3754644 manifold and you will have to use the upper carb linkage from that engine. See pic. The 216 linkage will bind.

Attached Images
20230605_142040.jpg (171.71 KB, 253 downloads)
16859908235152547578312836929822.jpg (124.64 KB, 253 downloads)
20230605_145906.jpg (223.45 KB, 243 downloads)
Last edited by Jethro in Va; Mon Jun 05 2023 07:00 PM. Reason: Add info

~~ Jethro
1954 3100
Back to Life
In the Dity Gallery
1951 3100 (gone) / 1956 4400 (still in the neighborhood) / 1957 6400 with dump body (retired) / 1959 3100 panel (in the woods junked) / 1978 Custom Deluxe K10 / 1993 S-10 4.3 / 2004 Chevy Crew Cab / 1945 John Deere H / 1952 John Deere B / 1966 John Deere 2510 / 1967 John Deere 1020
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 105
D
'Bolter
Great info!
Originally Posted by Jethro in Va
Once you drill the holes for the front mount, you must install the new front mount Before you install the engine..
Reading the notes from the tech guide, it says you have to pull the balancer - is that necessary? From the pic, I'm not seeing it - but I guess they wouldn't say that if its not necessary grin


'51 Chevy 3100 Truck - OEM 216 Engine; three speed column shift transmission
6 Bolt disc conversion with dual master/vacuum booster
12V alternator conversion.
235 engine in waiting grin
D'Ecosse #1503775 Mon Jun 05 2023 07:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2022
Posts: 341
J
'Bolter
Now... waterpump. In 56 the models were all changed, car and truck, to a lower more stylish stance. They lowered the radiator so they lowered the waterpump. Now it won't work for a simple swap because the fan is hitting the radiator in the older trucks.

One way is to take the pump off and press the pulley farther on the shaft and cut the excess off. One of the members will chime in and give you the gory details on how to do that. Problem is... now the fan is no longer in the center of the radiator, which may give cooling problems later.

I bought one of Pre68 Dave's adapter plates (he's one of us.) had my 216 waterpump rebuilt and the waterpump/fan is where it's supposed to be. See pics. Use the "search" feature and type in "Dave's adapter plate" Just grit your teeth and follow his instructions to the letter. Mine has not leaked a drop. No cooling issues. Oh yeah, use the 216 fan.

Attached Images
20220729_165838.jpg (173.23 KB, 233 downloads)
20220729_174243.jpg (367.94 KB, 233 downloads)

~~ Jethro
1954 3100
Back to Life
In the Dity Gallery
1951 3100 (gone) / 1956 4400 (still in the neighborhood) / 1957 6400 with dump body (retired) / 1959 3100 panel (in the woods junked) / 1978 Custom Deluxe K10 / 1993 S-10 4.3 / 2004 Chevy Crew Cab / 1945 John Deere H / 1952 John Deere B / 1966 John Deere 2510 / 1967 John Deere 1020
D'Ecosse #1503779 Mon Jun 05 2023 07:45 PM
Joined: Jun 2022
Posts: 341
J
'Bolter
Yes, you will need to use the 216 damper. Smaller diameter than the 235. Replace that seal while you have the balancer off. Line up the keyway and drive the 216 pulley on with a big block of wood and an 8 lb sledge. Do that After you install the front motor mount!

Ps. If you use your current temp sensor you will need an adapter. The hole is too big. Got mine at NAPA.

Another ps... take out the distributor and clean it good... make sure the weights are free to flop. Note the position of the rotor when you remove it and point it the same way when you reinstall it.

Last edited by Jethro in Va; Mon Jun 05 2023 08:48 PM. Reason: Add info

~~ Jethro
1954 3100
Back to Life
In the Dity Gallery
1951 3100 (gone) / 1956 4400 (still in the neighborhood) / 1957 6400 with dump body (retired) / 1959 3100 panel (in the woods junked) / 1978 Custom Deluxe K10 / 1993 S-10 4.3 / 2004 Chevy Crew Cab / 1945 John Deere H / 1952 John Deere B / 1966 John Deere 2510 / 1967 John Deere 1020
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 2,586
F
'Bolter
Jethro in Va. Now I don't have a horse in this race but using the 8 pound sledge with that thrust bearing to back it may be a little overkill. maybe you have a helper keeping the crank pried forward IDK just a caution. My last one I used an oaken 2x2 and just a large shop hammer ,it's running fine.

D'Ecosse #1503797 Mon Jun 05 2023 09:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 105
D
'Bolter
Lots more great info - thank you

I will likely put an HEI on there, but will get it running first!

What is the best method to remove the seal?
On my Motorcycle main output shaft seal I would use a couple of self-tapping machine screws at 180 into the seal and then pull it out using those
Will that work here or is there a better method?

Where exactly do you put the wooden block shim/block at the bellhousing to protect the main thrust bearing?
(Some of these things will be more obvious/make more sense once I actually get into it)
Edit - OK, think I got that one just wedge a block between back of flywheel and the bellhousing - can do that step while I am swapping the bells, clutch and tranny out

LOVE this forum, a TON of great info and everyone willing to help.

Last edited by D'Ecosse; Mon Jun 05 2023 10:18 PM.

'51 Chevy 3100 Truck - OEM 216 Engine; three speed column shift transmission
6 Bolt disc conversion with dual master/vacuum booster
12V alternator conversion.
235 engine in waiting grin
D'Ecosse #1503813 Mon Jun 05 2023 11:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,137
J
'Bolter

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Phak1, Woogeroo 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Home | FAQ | Gallery | Tech Tips | Events | Features | Search | Hoo-Ya Shop
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5