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Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375670 Thu Sep 03 2020 01:10 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 9,443
5
Master Gabster
The Full Monte gets expensive.
The piece of mind from going that route is priceless.
I am fortunate to have a machine shop which does top notch work and really cares about supporting crowds like ours. They make their money elsewhere, but they get their joy from helping us out.
Furthermore, the 261 is the envy of a lot of us, and I for one, would not like to hear about one flying apart from missing something due to lack of knowledge.

Last edited by 52Carl; Thu Sep 03 2020 01:15 AM.
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375674 Thu Sep 03 2020 01:30 AM
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 2,790
Housekeeping (Moderator) Making a Stovebolt Bed & Paint and Body Shop Forums
Originally Posted by Goach2
You'll only be able to measure the very top of the cylinder with that.
You need a true inside caliper

Attached Files

Kevin
First car '29 Ford Special Coupe
#2 - '29 Ford pickup restored from the ground up.
Newest Project - 51 Chevy 3100 work truck. Photos [flickr.com]
Busting rust since the mid-60's
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375678 Thu Sep 03 2020 02:20 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 21,021
H
Boltergeist
Dang! I fat-fingered the keyboard and lost several paragraphs of a reply! There is a detailed procedure on how to measure cylinder taper accurately with nothing but an old piston ring and a feeler gauge in John's tech tip on rebuilding his 261. Stand by- - - - -!
Jerry

Try this method: https://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/engines/cylinder%20taper/index.html

Note: A ring running in a taper-worn cylinder at 2000 RPM is flexing 60 times per second, trying to maintain contact with the cylinder wall- - - -expanding and contracting in less than 2 inches of piston movement. It doesn't take long for the ring to lose its spring tension and stop sealing compression and/or oil.
Jerry


The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375691 Thu Sep 03 2020 03:44 AM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 352
G
Goach2 Offline OP
Shop Shark
Ok, so I will try and track down a caliper like that, but in the meantime, I do have one of these.
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22149/filename/20200902_233825.jpg[/img]

So, if I understand the tech article, I would take off the top ring, put it in the cylinder, just under the top ridge, turn the crank so the piston goes to the top to keep it level, and then use feeler gauges stacked up to measure the gap.


1948 Chevrolet Thriftmaster 3/4 Ton
There are only 10 types of people in this world, those who can read binary and those who can't.
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375695 Thu Sep 03 2020 04:23 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 21,021
H
Boltergeist
Yes, as long as the piston you've got out of the engine is the same size as the cylinder you're measuring. If one engine has a different bore size than the other, you might have a little difficulty measuring the end gaps. Once you measure the gap at the top, you'll need to push the ring down 2-3 inches to get the bottom gap measurement. What you're doing is measuring the difference in circumference of the cylinder walls at different levels and dividing the difference by Pi. (3.14, actually, but 3 is close enough). "Circumference = Pi X Diameter"- - - - -basic high school plane geometry with a practical application!
Jerry


The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375709 Thu Sep 03 2020 01:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,484
P
Shop Shark
Don't be surprised if the rebuild total is 5 times the price of a running car...

Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375741 Thu Sep 03 2020 05:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 352
G
Goach2 Offline OP
Shop Shark
My father seems to think I inherited a caliper like this from him. I am still looking, but I did come across this:
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22161/filename/20200903_125807.jpg[/img]

Would this suffice?


1948 Chevrolet Thriftmaster 3/4 Ton
There are only 10 types of people in this world, those who can read binary and those who can't.
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1375827 Thu Sep 03 2020 11:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 21,021
H
Boltergeist
I give up!
BYE!
Jerry


The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1376031 Sat Sep 05 2020 06:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 352
G
Goach2 Offline OP
Shop Shark
Ok, finally got a little time to pull out the piston ring and try these measurements. Put the ring at the top, just under the ridge:
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22229/filename/20200905_134539.jpg[/img]

Stacking up the gap blades gives me this:
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22230/filename/20200905_134919.jpg[/img]

Then rotated piston down to here:
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22231/filename/20200905_135046.jpg[/img]

And gap showed:
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22232/filename/20200905_135550.jpg[/img]

So the top gap measures out to 0.096" and the bottom to 0.085". which leaves a difference of 0.011"

Divided by PI that gives me 0.00367. From the tech articles, it looks like up to 0.005 is acceptable without reboring and new rings. I was going to try and do this with a caliper as well, but this seems to be pretty accurate in itself.

So now, I'm assuming I need to do this to all cylinders and if they all check out, then perhaps move on to the bottom end?

I also picked up one of these:
[img]https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...umber/22233/filename/20200905_133735.jpg[/img]

Sorry, I ask a lot of questions, when it's something I've never done before. eek


1948 Chevrolet Thriftmaster 3/4 Ton
There are only 10 types of people in this world, those who can read binary and those who can't.
Re: Canadian 'Poncho' Rebuild
Goach2 #1376050 Sat Sep 05 2020 09:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 352
G
Goach2 Offline OP
Shop Shark
Ok, had time to check the rest of the cylinders, some were .005 or over, so I guess that puts this one at a rebore, with new piston territory, based on earlier comments. Is there any value in looking at the bottom end now? Based on some calls I've made, looks like I'm in the $4000-$5500 price range to shop it out.

This may have to sit in the corner for a bit...


1948 Chevrolet Thriftmaster 3/4 Ton
There are only 10 types of people in this world, those who can read binary and those who can't.
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