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Re: 235 won't start [Re: Hotrod Lincoln] #1333818 Thu Nov 14 2019 11:44 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 43
M
MontanaLee Offline OP
Wrench Fetcher
what size ground cable?


1948 3/4 ton Chevy Pickup
Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1333819 Fri Nov 15 2019 12:01 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 19,261
H
Hotrod Lincoln Offline
Boltergeist
At least a #1 or #0. Some people recommend 00, but they're a little difficult to get a good crimp on the terminals on the ends. I make mine from arc welder cable which has hundreds of strands of very fine wire and is very flexible. I've also got a swaging tool that I use with a 3-lb. hammer and an anvil to crimp the terminals on both ends. The cable, ring terminals, and battery post terminals are all available on Ebay, or any welding supply can probably make up custom cables in any length and size you need.
Jerry


The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: 235 won't start [Re: Hotrod Lincoln] #1333871 Fri Nov 15 2019 02:34 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 43
M
MontanaLee Offline OP
Wrench Fetcher
so to be clear, ground from battery to bolt holding starter, not to the frame?


1948 3/4 ton Chevy Pickup
Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1333875 Fri Nov 15 2019 03:09 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 19,261
H
Hotrod Lincoln Offline
Boltergeist
Eliminating that frame to engine cable reduces the circuit by two connections. Any extra connection point is a potential source for a dirty or loose circuit that causes slow cranking. Since the starter draws more current than any other component, it makes sense to provide it with the shortest path back to the battery. Yes, connect the ground cable to either a starter attaching bolt, or one of the bolts that hold the bellhousing to the block. Then run smaller ground wires from the engine to the body and frame to provide a ground path for headlights, dash instruments, etc. It's hard to have "too many" good grounds!

The only reason GM used the 2-cable setup was cost savings- - - - - two short braided cables cost less than one long heavy cable.
Jerry



The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: 235 won't start [Re: Hotrod Lincoln] #1333936 Fri Nov 15 2019 11:55 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 43
M
MontanaLee Offline OP
Wrench Fetcher
I am putting a 1/0 cable from the battery to the starter housing , eliminating the braided cable from the battery to the frame and kept. the braided cable from the starter to the frame. will that work.


1948 3/4 ton Chevy Pickup
Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1333944 Sat Nov 16 2019 01:10 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 19,261
H
Hotrod Lincoln Offline
Boltergeist
That should work great. Just to be sure you have a good ground path for lights, etc. unbolt both ends of the braided ground and scrub the connectors and the places they attach with a wire brush. Even a little resistance can cause dim headlights, poor charging system performance, and other hard to find gremlins. I remember one situation where a mid-1970's Plymouth would spike the alternator voltage to over 17 volts anytime the brake lights came on- - - - -cleaning the area where the voltage regulator bolted to the body and running a ground wire from the body to the engine solved the problem! The car had already had two alternators and a battery changed before the problem got to my shop. Parts and labor to fix it were less than $10.00!
Jerry


The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1333955 Sat Nov 16 2019 02:36 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 208
E
Ed Hotaling Offline
Shop Shark
Just a few thoughts:
If the ground strap is old, it could be corroded internally. I had this problem on a tractor I had. Even after converting to 12 volts, it was a pain to start. When I replaced both cables, it would crank so fast that it would make oil pressure!
Another thing to check for a slow starter is the switch contacts on top of the starter. I had to replace the one on my '46 last year. It was getting so it didn't want to crank and a new switch was all it needed.
My final thought is that the tractor had gotten so it would only start if it was towed nearly half a mile. Turns out the valves need to be adjusted. Who knew? Not me.:)
There's not much to go wrong with these systems, but a few things often get overlooked.

Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1333982 Sat Nov 16 2019 03:00 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 43
M
MontanaLee Offline OP
Wrench Fetcher
thanks folks, I appreciate the input!


1948 3/4 ton Chevy Pickup
Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1333990 Sat Nov 16 2019 04:30 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 19,261
H
Hotrod Lincoln Offline
Boltergeist
Ed, that's a good point about those flat braided ground straps. The crimp connection between the braid and the ring terminal on the end is subject to corrosion that can't be cleaned nor seen readily. Using a low-reading voltmeter to monitor the voltage drop from end to end of a cable while cranking can be a real eye-opener!
Jerry


The murder victim was drowned in a bathtub full of Rice Krispies and milk.
The coroner blamed the crime on a cereal killer!

Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
Re: 235 won't start [Re: MontanaLee] #1334087 Sun Nov 17 2019 04:12 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 43
M
MontanaLee Offline OP
Wrench Fetcher
further update
update:

1. new Optima battery
2. now 1/0 positive cable
3. fuel filter bowl is 1/2 full - which is ok
4. new 1/o ground directly from new, fully charged Optima 6 volt battery
5. `I have spark, but turns very very slow, and sometimes not catching.
6. my next move is to remove the starter
\
keep in mind, it was running just fine, then it got colder, and troubles began

is there a way to test the starter in the vehicle to see if its bad or is removing the starter the next step? I have never done it but looks pretty simple.


thanks


1948 3/4 ton Chevy Pickup
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